Honda Car Forum

Wow what can I say about this dealer. They are the worst dealer I've
even been too. The sales team are not friendly and knows very little
about the car and all they can tell you is that there is 4 wheels and
a steering... That wasn't the bad part because I did my research and
downloaded the car's brochure from the Acura website. My worst peeve
is that they try to screw you during the purchase and after the
purchase.

When I went to purchase last summer my car the salesman can't even get
the price right. He was showing me all these calculations about how
much it would cost with tax and so worth and in the end when I ask him
to explain in detail he couldn't even come up with the same amount
anymore... He also printed out a price list from last years model
instead of the current year's model... In the end I don't' even know
how much he scammed me cause I was soo confused. My experience there
was so horrible that I would never want to buy a car from them again.
BTW the salesman was so incompetent that I was dealer with the manager
because he keep saying that only the manager knows what the real price
is and he doesn't have access on his computer...

Since I purchased my car there I figured the servicing should be a
different story. Boy was I wrong. They are very disorganize and don't
even remember making an appointment with me... They must be the
slowest working bunch I've ever seen cause they require that I leave
my car for the whole day for at least 4 hours to change my tires for
winter. Acura told me that each service comes with a free car wash
when I purchase my car. When I came back 4 hours later I saw my winter
tires on, but they were incredibly dirty(4 new tires), however I
noticed that the car was clean.... I asked them why and they said that
they must have put my tires on after the car was washed...

Anyway there's more but I'm too lazy to type. I wished there was a
site that review dealers. If I knew before hand how terrible their
service were then I would've never gone there in the first place.
Luckily the car runs well so I won't need to visit them more then I
have to. Acura you build good cars, but your dealer is tarnishing your
image. I will do my part and write the truth whenever they send me
their customer survey. BTW did I mention that the dealer even persuade
me to always give %100 in the survey no matter what and that instead
they promise to rectify any dissatisfaction that I have!!!!!

PS. I had terrible service at Honda from across the street, which is
where I purchased my first car, however their service is nowhere as
bad as Acura. I am quite disappointed.

Data <4dataentry@gmail.com> wrote in news:5e72b587-5262-456b-9a55-
d04fb3bae22d@z14g2000yqa.googlegroups.com:

> Wow what can I say about this dealer. They are the worst dealer I've
> even been too. The sales team are not friendly and knows very little
> about the car and all they can tell you is that there is 4 wheels and
> a steering... That wasn't the bad part because I did my research and
> downloaded the car's brochure from the Acura website. My worst peeve
> is that they try to screw you during the purchase and after the
> purchase.
>
> When I went to purchase last summer my car the salesman can't even get
> the price right. He was showing me all these calculations about how
> much it would cost with tax and so worth and in the end when I ask him
> to explain in detail he couldn't even come up with the same amount
> anymore... He also printed out a price list from last years model
> instead of the current year's model... In the end I don't' even know
> how much he scammed me cause I was soo confused. My experience there
> was so horrible that I would never want to buy a car from them again.
> BTW the salesman was so incompetent that I was dealer with the manager
> because he keep saying that only the manager knows what the real price
> is and he doesn't have access on his computer...



This must have been your first new car purchase. The ONLY "real" price
is the one you end up paying.

"Dealer invoice" is fiction.
"We're not making much on this vehicle" is fiction.
"That's a standard charge" is fiction.
"'Freight, delivery and PDI' are normal additions to the invoice" is
fiction.

Are you sensing a pattern here?

ANY "price" is fiction. Until you sign for it. And they will use any and
all high-pressure tactics, lies and obfuscations to get you to sign for
that fictional price in order to make it legally non-fiction.

There are certain tactics you must use to counter theirs. You need to
learn those tactics, otherwise you will serve as a car salesman's
doormat...forever.

Buying a new car can be one of life's worst experiences. One of life's
_best_ experiences is standing up to, and winning against, a salesman
who has seen everything. That takes smarts, guts and patience.

Your only real weapon is the willingness to walk away. If your price is
truly unreasonable, they will let you go. If they make you stay, you've
won the battle and it's just a matter of time before you get your price.



>
> Since I purchased my car there I figured the servicing should be a
> different story.




So after all that foofaraw you actually _bought_ from these guys? You
have a lot to learn, grasshopper.



--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

On Apr 9, 9:13 pm, Tegger <inva...@invalid.inv> wrote:
> Data <4dataen...@gmail.com> wrote in news:5e72b587-5262-456b-9a55-
> d04fb3bae...@z14g2000yqa.googlegroups.com:
>
>
>
> > Wow what can I say about this dealer. They are the worst dealer I've
> > even been too. The sales team are not friendly and knows very little
> > about the car and all they can tell you is that there is 4 wheels and
> > a steering... That wasn't the bad part because I did my research and
> > downloaded the car's brochure from the Acura website. My worst peeve
> > is that they try to screw you during the purchase and after the
> > purchase.
>
> > When I went to purchase last summer my car the salesman can't even get
> > the price right. He was showing me all these calculations about how
> > much it would cost with tax and so worth and in the end when I ask him
> > to explain in detail he couldn't even come up with the same amount
> > anymore... He also printed out a price list from last years model
> > instead of the current year's model... In the end I don't' even know
> > how much he scammed me cause I was soo confused. My experience there
> > was so horrible that I would never want to buy a car from them again.
> > BTW the salesman was so incompetent that I was dealer with the manager
> > because he keep saying that only the manager knows what the real price
> > is and he doesn't have access on his computer...
>
> This must have been your first new car purchase. The ONLY "real" price
> is the one you end up paying.
>
> "Dealer invoice" is fiction.
> "We're not making much on this vehicle" is fiction.
> "That's a standard charge" is fiction.
> "'Freight, delivery and PDI' are normal additions to the invoice" is
> fiction.
>
> Are you sensing a pattern here?
>
> ANY "price" is fiction. Until you sign for it. And they will use any and
> all high-pressure tactics, lies and obfuscations to get you to sign for
> that fictional price in order to make it legally non-fiction.
>
> There are certain tactics you must use to counter theirs. You need to
> learn those tactics, otherwise you will serve as a car salesman's
> doormat...forever.
>
> Buying a new car can be one of life's worst experiences. One of life's
> _best_ experiences is standing up to, and winning against, a salesman
> who has seen everything. That takes smarts, guts and patience.
>
> Your only real weapon is the willingness to walk away. If your price is
> truly unreasonable, they will let you go. If they make you stay, you've
> won the battle and it's just a matter of time before you get your price.
>
>
>
> > Since I purchased my car there I figured the servicing should be a
> > different story.
>
> So after all that foofaraw you actually _bought_ from these guys? You
> have a lot to learn, grasshopper.
>
> --
> Tegger
>
> The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQwww.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Yes it was my first car. They made my head spin so much that I still
don't know what was the final price of the car. They told me that they
are doing like Toyota, which there is no need for negotiations anymore
since the price is the lowest they can go. The reason is so that
customer's do not need to shop at different dealers since it is the
same price everywhere... In the end I did not get any rebate not even
free accessories and paid an extra 1000$ for 4 new winter tires, which
I later found quite costly. I agree with you, I don't want to go thru
that again its the worse experience ever since I know I was going to
be screwed, but just didn't know by how much... I really don't like
that dealer and wished that I've gone with Honda or something since
the other closest Acura dealer is so much further away. Luckily only
need to see them maybe twice a year for tire change and annual
maintenance. Loved the car, just don't like the people there since I
always get screwed. Last visit was to put my summer tires back on,
which they say I also needed a alignment. They charged me almost $200
for 3 hours since they have to balanced my tires as well. I'm still
not sure if I really needed balancing since I have a different set of
rims for my winter and summer tires... The guy told me its necessary
since they are moving my tires around. Its sad that we need to decide
on a car based on the service instead of the car itself. I wouldn't be
surprise if I was treated better at Hundai...

Thanks for the reply

Data <4dataentry@gmail.com> wrote in
news:961f12ee-3d7f-4f01-ab5d-77dc957fed05@n8g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:

> On Apr 9, 9:13 pm, Tegger <inva...@invalid.inv> wrote:

>
> Yes it was my first car. They made my head spin so much that I still
> don't know what was the final price of the car.



That's what they meant to do, and they succeeded, counting on your
obvious lack of experience.


> They told me that they
> are doing like Toyota, which there is no need for negotiations anymore
> since the price is the lowest they can go. The reason is so that
> customer's do not need to shop at different dealers since it is the
> same price everywhere...



WHAT???? What a line of complete BS.

Car prices are ALWAYS negotiable, period. Saturn was once the sole
exception, but I'm not sure they do this any more.



> In the end I did not get any rebate not even
> free accessories and paid an extra 1000$ for 4 new winter tires, which
> I later found quite costly. I agree with you, I don't want to go thru
> that again its the worse experience ever since I know I was going to
> be screwed, but just didn't know by how much... I really don't like
> that dealer and wished that I've gone with Honda or something since
> the other closest Acura dealer is so much further away. Luckily only
> need to see them maybe twice a year for tire change and annual
> maintenance. Loved the car, just don't like the people there since I
> always get screwed. Last visit was to put my summer tires back on,
> which they say I also needed a alignment. They charged me almost $200
> for 3 hours since they have to balanced my tires as well. I'm still
> not sure if I really needed balancing since I have a different set of
> rims for my winter and summer tires... The guy told me its necessary
> since they are moving my tires around.



You really got rooked, primarily becuase you didn't know what you were
doing. Inexperience and lack of knowledge is something they can smell on
you. And, like wolves, they love the smell of fear.



> Its sad that we need to decide
> on a car based on the service instead of the car itself. I wouldn't be
> surprise if I was treated better at Hundai...



You won't be. They're all the same. The same salesmen tend to move
around from dealership to dealership, even between makes. Plus they all
talk together and trade tips and stories. They KNOW you.

Here's how you do it properly:

Decide on a budget, to the penny. This budget figure is an "on the road"
price for the car. Arrange your own financing with a bank or something.
Walk into the dealership and ask what they can put you in for that exact
dollar amount. The dollar amount contains any and all fees, taxes, and
any other charges, surcharges, ANYTHING. It is a TOTAL. It's the amount
that will be written on the check. "On the road" is the phrase used.

When you find the car you like, stick to the "on the road" figure you
came in with, and refuse to sign for anything other than that exact
figure on the bottom line. If they want to add things of any kind to the
invoice, the amount of those things has to come out of your "on the
road" figure. Period. Do NOT BUDGE. That "on the road" number is FINAL.

They will put extraordinary pressure on you to change your dollar
amount. They will leave you stewing and worrying in the salesman's
office for fifteen or twenty minutes while the salesman "talks" to his
manager. They will do their utmost to make you feel as uncomfortable as
possible. They will feed you all sorts of bullshit about how you need to
pay more or allow this or that obscure additional charge. No matter
what, you MUST NOT GIVE IN.

If they insist you must sign for more than your chosen dollar amount,
get up and WALK OUT. Do not hesitate or turn back. If you are forcibly
made to go back, you've won, even if it takes another hour for them to
agree to your dollar amount. If they let you leave, your price was too
low. No big deal. Up the amount a bit, and try another dealership. There
are lots of cars for sale. Proper prior research will enable you to
arrive at a reasonable "on the road" amount, to minimize the chance of
going in at too low a price.




>
> Thanks for the reply


You're welcome. I'd also point out that the more mechanical knowledge
you have about cars, the tougher it will be for the sales or service
departments to rip you off. Use this one as a learning experience.


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

snip


>
> Here's how you do it properly:
>
> Decide on a budget, to the penny. This budget figure is an "on the road"
> price for the car. Arrange your own financing with a bank or something.
> Walk into the dealership and ask what they can put you in for that exact
> dollar amount. The dollar amount contains any and all fees, taxes, and
> any other charges, surcharges, ANYTHING. It is a TOTAL. It's the amount
> that will be written on the check. "On the road" is the phrase used.
>
> When you find the car you like, stick to the "on the road" figure you
> came in with, and refuse to sign for anything other than that exact
> figure on the bottom line. If they want to add things of any kind to the
> invoice, the amount of those things has to come out of your "on the
> road" figure. Period. Do NOT BUDGE. That "on the road" number is FINAL.
>
> They will put extraordinary pressure on you to change your dollar
> amount. They will leave you stewing and worrying in the salesman's
> office for fifteen or twenty minutes while the salesman "talks" to his
> manager. They will do their utmost to make you feel as uncomfortable as
> possible. They will feed you all sorts of bullshit about how you need to
> pay more or allow this or that obscure additional charge. No matter
> what, you MUST NOT GIVE IN.
>
> If they insist you must sign for more than your chosen dollar amount,
> get up and WALK OUT. Do not hesitate or turn back. If you are forcibly
> made to go back, you've won, even if it takes another hour for them to
> agree to your dollar amount. If they let you leave, your price was too
> low. No big deal. Up the amount a bit, and try another dealership. There
> are lots of cars for sale. Proper prior research will enable you to
> arrive at a reasonable "on the road" amount, to minimize the chance of
> going in at too low a price.
>
>


You need to put this in a form of a booklet and sell it on eBay or
elsewhere. Make it about three times bigger in the way of word count
and you could have a second income!

Very nicely done..

JT

Grumpy AuContraire <Grumpy@ExtraGrumpyville.com> wrote in news:E7dEl.550174
$Mh5.307629@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:

>
> snip
>
>
>>
>> Here's how you do it properly:
>>
>> Decide on a budget, to the penny. This budget figure is an "on the road"
>> price for the car. Arrange your own financing with a bank or something.
>> Walk into the dealership and ask what they can put you in for that exact
>> dollar amount. The dollar amount contains any and all fees, taxes, and
>> any other charges, surcharges, ANYTHING. It is a TOTAL. It's the amount
>> that will be written on the check. "On the road" is the phrase used.
>>
>> When you find the car you like, stick to the "on the road" figure you
>> came in with, and refuse to sign for anything other than that exact
>> figure on the bottom line. If they want to add things of any kind to the
>> invoice, the amount of those things has to come out of your "on the
>> road" figure. Period. Do NOT BUDGE. That "on the road" number is FINAL.
>>
>> They will put extraordinary pressure on you to change your dollar
>> amount. They will leave you stewing and worrying in the salesman's
>> office for fifteen or twenty minutes while the salesman "talks" to his
>> manager. They will do their utmost to make you feel as uncomfortable as
>> possible. They will feed you all sorts of bullshit about how you need to
>> pay more or allow this or that obscure additional charge. No matter
>> what, you MUST NOT GIVE IN.
>>
>> If they insist you must sign for more than your chosen dollar amount,
>> get up and WALK OUT. Do not hesitate or turn back. If you are forcibly
>> made to go back, you've won, even if it takes another hour for them to
>> agree to your dollar amount. If they let you leave, your price was too
>> low. No big deal. Up the amount a bit, and try another dealership. There
>> are lots of cars for sale. Proper prior research will enable you to
>> arrive at a reasonable "on the road" amount, to minimize the chance of
>> going in at too low a price.
>>
>>
>
>
> You need to put this in a form of a booklet and sell it on eBay or
> elsewhere. Make it about three times bigger in the way of word count
> and you could have a second income!
>
> Very nicely done..
>



Thanks. Maybe someday I'll do that. If nobody else already has such a thing
on the market, that is...

By the way, I forgot to mention trade-ins. Many people want to trade in
their old car for the new one. This complicates financial matters with the
dealers (and costs you money), but there's still a way of fitting that into
the intent of my previous missive...


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Tegger wrote:
> Grumpy AuContraire <Grumpy@ExtraGrumpyville.com> wrote in news:E7dEl.550174
> $Mh5.307629@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:
>
>
>>snip
>>
>>
>>
>>>Here's how you do it properly:
>>>
>>>Decide on a budget, to the penny. This budget figure is an "on the road"
>>>price for the car. Arrange your own financing with a bank or something.
>>>Walk into the dealership and ask what they can put you in for that exact
>>>dollar amount. The dollar amount contains any and all fees, taxes, and
>>>any other charges, surcharges, ANYTHING. It is a TOTAL. It's the amount
>>>that will be written on the check. "On the road" is the phrase used.
>>>
>>>When you find the car you like, stick to the "on the road" figure you
>>>came in with, and refuse to sign for anything other than that exact
>>>figure on the bottom line. If they want to add things of any kind to the
>>>invoice, the amount of those things has to come out of your "on the
>>>road" figure. Period. Do NOT BUDGE. That "on the road" number is FINAL.
>>>
>>>They will put extraordinary pressure on you to change your dollar
>>>amount. They will leave you stewing and worrying in the salesman's
>>>office for fifteen or twenty minutes while the salesman "talks" to his
>>>manager. They will do their utmost to make you feel as uncomfortable as
>>>possible. They will feed you all sorts of bullshit about how you need to
>>>pay more or allow this or that obscure additional charge. No matter
>>>what, you MUST NOT GIVE IN.
>>>
>>>If they insist you must sign for more than your chosen dollar amount,
>>>get up and WALK OUT. Do not hesitate or turn back. If you are forcibly
>>>made to go back, you've won, even if it takes another hour for them to
>>>agree to your dollar amount. If they let you leave, your price was too
>>>low. No big deal. Up the amount a bit, and try another dealership. There
>>>are lots of cars for sale. Proper prior research will enable you to
>>>arrive at a reasonable "on the road" amount, to minimize the chance of
>>>going in at too low a price.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>You need to put this in a form of a booklet and sell it on eBay or
>>elsewhere. Make it about three times bigger in the way of word count
>>and you could have a second income!
>>
>>Very nicely done..
>>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks. Maybe someday I'll do that. If nobody else already has such a thing
> on the market, that is...
>
> By the way, I forgot to mention trade-ins. Many people want to trade in
> their old car for the new one. This complicates financial matters with the
> dealers (and costs you money), but there's still a way of fitting that into
> the intent of my previous missive...


In my observational experience, (I don't buy new cars), it is almost
always to the buyer's advantage to sell his current car separately. It
might finance a vacation or pay down some of the principal after the fact.

JT

Grumpy AuContraire <Grumpy@ExtraGrumpyville.com> wrote in
news:w4vEl.553849$Mh5.140332@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:

>
>
> Tegger wrote:

>>
>> By the way, I forgot to mention trade-ins. Many people want to trade
>> in their old car for the new one. This complicates financial matters
>> with the dealers (and costs you money), but there's still a way of
>> fitting that into the intent of my previous missive...
>
>
> In my observational experience, (I don't buy new cars), it is almost
> always to the buyer's advantage to sell his current car separately.



In just about all areas, yes. In my province of Canada, no. Here the tax
rules are written so as to make it highly disadvantageous to sell your car
yourself instead of trading it in. The auto dealers lobbied hard to the
provincial government for this change, and they got it. We're the ones that
pay for it.

Also, lots of people can't be bothered to try and sell separately, just
because of the time and hassle it can take. They'd rather take a bit of a
financial hit and be quickly and easily rid of the old car.



--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Tegger wrote:

> Grumpy AuContraire <Grumpy@ExtraGrumpyville.com> wrote in
> news:w4vEl.553849$Mh5.140332@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:
>
>
>>
>>Tegger wrote:
>
>
>>>By the way, I forgot to mention trade-ins. Many people want to trade
>>>in their old car for the new one. This complicates financial matters
>>>with the dealers (and costs you money), but there's still a way of
>>>fitting that into the intent of my previous missive...
>>
>>
>>In my observational experience, (I don't buy new cars), it is almost
>>always to the buyer's advantage to sell his current car separately.
>
>
>
>
> In just about all areas, yes. In my province of Canada, no. Here the tax
> rules are written so as to make it highly disadvantageous to sell your car
> yourself instead of trading it in. The auto dealers lobbied hard to the
> provincial government for this change, and they got it. We're the ones that
> pay for it.
>
> Also, lots of people can't be bothered to try and sell separately, just
> because of the time and hassle it can take. They'd rather take a bit of a
> financial hit and be quickly and easily rid of the old car.


You need to come on down to Texas for some trainin' on how to contain
unruly guv'ment. <G>

JT

Grumpy AuContraire <Grumpy@ExtraGrumpyville.com> wrote in
news:VU8Fl.120674$4m1.50542@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:


>
>
> You need to come on down to Texas for some trainin' on how to contain
> unruly guv'ment. <G>
>
> JT
>
>



I wish. And "unruly" does describe ours.

As a wicked coincidence, have you ever seen our Premier (governor)?
He looks a lot like Lee Harvey Oswald, only older.

<http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/img/11-07/1122oswald2.jpg>
<http://1.bp.blogspot.com/__1nn2kem-98/RgcuyQlqwWI/AAAAAAAAAJs/Wbtmnqig_Vg/s320/Dalton+McGuinty.jpg>



--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/