Honda Car Forum

NetDoe wrote:
> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> news:Yr-dnXl28aSm1pTVnZ2dnUVZ_hudnZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>> NetDoe wrote:
>>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>>> news:yL-dnXRj7oJ5oJTVnZ2dnUVZ_q2hnZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>>>> NetDoe wrote:
>>>>> I have the Hanes manual, and the procedure seems
>>>>> straight-forward enough (I'm mechanically inclined).
>>>>> However, what are some "gotchas"? Also any recomms
>>>>> for an effective brake-bleeding kit that won't bleed my
>>>>> wallet?
>>>>>
>>>>> -Zilla
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> no gotchas - it's very straightforward. a couple of tips though:
>>>>
>>>> 1. fit the cylinder dry, then bleed at the brake pipe junctions on the
>>>> cylinder before bleeding the rest of the system at the calipers.
>>>>
>>>> 2. keep plenty of water handy in case of spillage. never wipe brake
>>>> fluid off paintwork, the paint will come off with it. simply wash with
>>>> water, then don't touch, even if you're tempted to. and don't spill
>>>> water into an open brake reservoir!
>>>>
>>>> as for bleeding kits, don't waste any money on one - use the neighbor
>>>> kid to help you, if you don't have one of your own. you're bleeding a
>>>> new cylinder, so make sure you bleed properly - get the pedal pressed
>>>> all the way to the floor to expel all the air.
>>> Ok thanks. I plan to drape plastic over the left-front fender, just to
>>> protect
>>> against spillage. Also the manual mentions bleeding the ABS modulator.
>>> Is that necessary?
>>>
>>>
>> theoretically, yes. but reality is, especially if you bleed at the m/c
>> first, you can get away without it. [you didn't pay for this advice, so
>> use it at your own risk!]
>>
>
> So when you say "especially if you bleed at the m/c
> first" you imply bench-bleeding?

no, do it with the m/c /in/ the car - bleed at the brake line screws.
you'll find that once fitted, if you fill the reservoir and simply wait,
most of the time, the m/c will bleed itself. once the bubbles stop
coming out of the line screws, then get your assistant to press down on
the pedal to ensure all air is expelled, then hold while you tighten.

and make sure you use a proper flare nut wrench. using a standard open
end wrench is a great way to ruin the hex flats and make life very
difficult for yourself.


>
> Where is the bleeder valve for the ABS modulator, or is it obvious?
> My Hanes manual does not show it.
>
>

you need to take the haynes manual, separate all the pages and roll each
one into a crumpled ball, collect into a heap, douse with gasoline, then
apply a source of ignition. after you've finished dancing on the ashes,
go to helminc.com and buy the proper honda workshop manual. it costs
more, but it helps you with questions just like this by actually
answering them. the best tool you'll ever buy for that vehicle.

"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:GKOdnfqiX9s_n5fVnZ2dnUVZ_hKdnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
> NetDoe wrote:
> > "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> > news:Yr-dnXl28aSm1pTVnZ2dnUVZ_hudnZ2d@speakeasy.net...
> >> NetDoe wrote:
> >>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> >>> news:yL-dnXRj7oJ5oJTVnZ2dnUVZ_q2hnZ2d@speakeasy.net...
> >>>> NetDoe wrote:
> >>>>> I have the Hanes manual, and the procedure seems
> >>>>> straight-forward enough (I'm mechanically inclined).
> >>>>> However, what are some "gotchas"? Also any recomms
> >>>>> for an effective brake-bleeding kit that won't bleed my
> >>>>> wallet?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -Zilla
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> no gotchas - it's very straightforward. a couple of tips though:
> >>>>
> >>>> 1. fit the cylinder dry, then bleed at the brake pipe junctions on
the
> >>>> cylinder before bleeding the rest of the system at the calipers.
> >>>>
> >>>> 2. keep plenty of water handy in case of spillage. never wipe brake
> >>>> fluid off paintwork, the paint will come off with it. simply wash
with
> >>>> water, then don't touch, even if you're tempted to. and don't spill
> >>>> water into an open brake reservoir!
> >>>>
> >>>> as for bleeding kits, don't waste any money on one - use the neighbor
> >>>> kid to help you, if you don't have one of your own. you're bleeding
a
> >>>> new cylinder, so make sure you bleed properly - get the pedal pressed
> >>>> all the way to the floor to expel all the air.
> >>> Ok thanks. I plan to drape plastic over the left-front fender, just to
> >>> protect
> >>> against spillage. Also the manual mentions bleeding the ABS modulator.
> >>> Is that necessary?
> >>>
> >>>
> >> theoretically, yes. but reality is, especially if you bleed at the m/c
> >> first, you can get away without it. [you didn't pay for this advice,
so
> >> use it at your own risk!]
> >>
> >
> > So when you say "especially if you bleed at the m/c
> > first" you imply bench-bleeding?
>
> no, do it with the m/c /in/ the car - bleed at the brake line screws.
> you'll find that once fitted, if you fill the reservoir and simply wait,
> most of the time, the m/c will bleed itself. once the bubbles stop
> coming out of the line screws, then get your assistant to press down on
> the pedal to ensure all air is expelled, then hold while you tighten.
>
> and make sure you use a proper flare nut wrench. using a standard open
> end wrench is a great way to ruin the hex flats and make life very
> difficult for yourself.

I see, that was #1 of your orig response. I planned to use a flare nut
wrench.

>
>
> >
> > Where is the bleeder valve for the ABS modulator, or is it obvious?
> > My Hanes manual does not show it.
> >
> >
>
> you need to take the haynes manual, separate all the pages and roll each
> one into a crumpled ball, collect into a heap, douse with gasoline, then
> apply a source of ignition. after you've finished dancing on the ashes,
> go to helminc.com and buy the proper honda workshop manual. it costs
> more, but it helps you with questions just like this by actually
> answering them. the best tool you'll ever buy for that vehicle.

....been ordered, waiting for it in the mail. In the meantime I ask questions
and hope for answers.

"NetDoe" <netdoe01XSPAM@XSPAMbellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:AOnOj.10681$DY1.8256@bignews5.bellsouth.net.. .
>
> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> news:GKOdnfqiX9s_n5fVnZ2dnUVZ_hKdnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>> NetDoe wrote:
>> > "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
>> > message
>> > news:Yr-dnXl28aSm1pTVnZ2dnUVZ_hudnZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>> >> NetDoe wrote:
>> >>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
>> >>> message
>> >>> news:yL-dnXRj7oJ5oJTVnZ2dnUVZ_q2hnZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>> >>>> NetDoe wrote:
>> >>>>> I have the Hanes manual, and the procedure seems
>> >>>>> straight-forward enough (I'm mechanically
>> >>>>> inclined).
>> >>>>> However, what are some "gotchas"? Also any recomms
>> >>>>> for an effective brake-bleeding kit that won't
>> >>>>> bleed my
>> >>>>> wallet?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> -Zilla
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>> no gotchas - it's very straightforward. a couple of
>> >>>> tips though:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> 1. fit the cylinder dry, then bleed at the brake
>> >>>> pipe junctions on
> the
>> >>>> cylinder before bleeding the rest of the system at
>> >>>> the calipers.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> 2. keep plenty of water handy in case of spillage.
>> >>>> never wipe brake
>> >>>> fluid off paintwork, the paint will come off with
>> >>>> it. simply wash
> with
>> >>>> water, then don't touch, even if you're tempted to.
>> >>>> and don't spill
>> >>>> water into an open brake reservoir!
>> >>>>
>> >>>> as for bleeding kits, don't waste any money on one -
>> >>>> use the neighbor
>> >>>> kid to help you, if you don't have one of your own.
>> >>>> you're bleeding
> a
>> >>>> new cylinder, so make sure you bleed properly - get
>> >>>> the pedal pressed
>> >>>> all the way to the floor to expel all the air.
>> >>> Ok thanks. I plan to drape plastic over the
>> >>> left-front fender, just to
>> >>> protect
>> >>> against spillage. Also the manual mentions bleeding
>> >>> the ABS modulator.
>> >>> Is that necessary?
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >> theoretically, yes. but reality is, especially if you
>> >> bleed at the m/c
>> >> first, you can get away without it. [you didn't pay
>> >> for this advice,
> so
>> >> use it at your own risk!]
>> >>
>> >
>> > So when you say "especially if you bleed at the m/c
>> > first" you imply bench-bleeding?
>>
>> no, do it with the m/c /in/ the car - bleed at the brake
>> line screws.
>> you'll find that once fitted, if you fill the reservoir
>> and simply wait,
>> most of the time, the m/c will bleed itself. once the
>> bubbles stop
>> coming out of the line screws, then get your assistant to
>> press down on
>> the pedal to ensure all air is expelled, then hold while
>> you tighten.
>>
>> and make sure you use a proper flare nut wrench. using a
>> standard open
>> end wrench is a great way to ruin the hex flats and make
>> life very
>> difficult for yourself.
>
> I see, that was #1 of your orig response. I planned to use
> a flare nut
> wrench.
>
>>
>>
>> >
>> > Where is the bleeder valve for the ABS modulator, or is
>> > it obvious?
>> > My Hanes manual does not show it.
>> >
>> >
>>
>> you need to take the haynes manual, separate all the
>> pages and roll each
>> one into a crumpled ball, collect into a heap, douse with
>> gasoline, then
>> apply a source of ignition. after you've finished
>> dancing on the ashes,
>> go to helminc.com and buy the proper honda workshop
>> manual. it costs
>> more, but it helps you with questions just like this by
>> actually
>> answering them. the best tool you'll ever buy for that
>> vehicle.
>
> ...been ordered, waiting for it in the mail. In the
> meantime I ask questions
> and hope for answers.

Just my opinion, and not to throw out the baby with the
bathwater (read: Jim Beam's opinion on this with his other
occasionally helpful suggestions, when he's feeling like
being constructive, like all of us) but i think buying a
Helm manual is overrated for your 95 Accord and many 90s
Civics. So much information is freely available on the net
for Hondas this vintage. E.g. see the bulk of the FS manual
for your 95 Accord at
http://www.honda.co.uk/car/owner/workshop.html. Also,
Autozone has (for free) much info (specific to maintaining
and repairing the 95 Accord, and much from the FS manual
again) at its site.

Plus, I disagree with a number of people here that Haynes is
so awful. From what I have seen, I do prefer Chilton's (fact
is it reproduces much verbatim from the FS manual), and I
use mine often, but the Haynes will probably be of some
help.

"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:J_Gdnarh0o3_yZTVnZ2dnUVZ_oKhnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
> Tegger wrote:
> > "NetDoe" <netdoe01XSPAM@XSPAMbellsouth.net> wrote in news:TaaOj.55430
> > $Er2.26247@bignews6.bellsouth.net:
> >
> >> I have the Hanes manual, and the procedure seems
> >> straight-forward enough (I'm mechanically inclined).
> >> However, what are some "gotchas"? Also any recomms
> >> for an effective brake-bleeding kit that won't bleed my
> >> wallet?
> >>
> >
> >
> > You don't need a kit at all, provided you bench bleed first. Do not
install
> > the new MC "dry".
> >
> > http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/maste...ace/index.html
> >
> >
> >
>
> but if you install "wet", you can get fluid all over the place - your
> workbench, not just your car. installing dry, then bleeding at the line
> connections ensures that all bleeding is controlled, and minimizes air
> that has to be bled through the rest of the system, particularly
> relevant for abs.
>
> indeed, i've replaced cylinders like this and not had to do the rest of
> the system at all. not standard practice of course, but it is possible
> if the brake lines don't empty, and they won't if the caliper bleeds
> aren't opened. try it - you'll be pleasantly surprised.

You know, if you think about it, installing dry on the car and then bleeding
it with the "bench-bleeding" fittings and hoses that come with the new M/C
kit IS bench-bleeding it.

....so that's what I did, and worked like a champ. As Jim says, no mess.
I bought a self-bleeding kit but ended up NOT opening/using it since my
10-yr old and wife were glad to help.

Total cost:
- M/C = $40
- Dot 3 fluid (2x12oz) = 4
- Bleeder rubber hose = 1

So for <$50 and 4 hrs of getting the parts and actually doing the work,
I have a partly new brake system! It was my first time to do it.

...and my old back hurts!

Tegger (tegger@tegger.c0m) writes:
>
>
> Leaks are no problem.
>
> Stuff a couple of golf tees in the holes as you transport the new MC if you
> have nothing else to plug them with.


I made plugs for my self about 25 years ago. I used an old
brake tube and an old brake hose from a Datsun(?) or
Toyota(?). I cut the fittings off the brake hoses, dug
the remaining rubber out of the fittings and then brazed
(bronze rod) the hole closed. I now had a female plug to
put on the end of a disconnected brake tube, to prevent
the fluid from all siphoning out. For a set of _male_ plugs,
I cut the brake tube flush with the male nut, and brazed
it closed. I snug the plugs down with a pair of wrenches.

These bunch of male nuts and female nuts come in
very handy when disconnecting the brake system.

A person could probably do the same thing with a propane
torch, some plumbers solder and flux. Steel wool etc. the
metal bright and shiny, apply flux and solder. Don't cut the
tube flush... leave some sticking out and solder the tube
closed.


>
> --
> Tegger
>
> The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
> www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

"M.A. Stewart" <cf005@FreeNet.Carleton.CA> wrote in message
news:fuo0v8$tc$1@theodyn.ncf.ca...
> Tegger (tegger@tegger.c0m) writes:
> >
> >
> > Leaks are no problem.
> >
> > Stuff a couple of golf tees in the holes as you transport the new MC if
you
> > have nothing else to plug them with.
>
>
> I made plugs for my self about 25 years ago. I used an old
> brake tube and an old brake hose from a Datsun(?) or
> Toyota(?). I cut the fittings off the brake hoses, dug
> the remaining rubber out of the fittings and then brazed
> (bronze rod) the hole closed. I now had a female plug to
> put on the end of a disconnected brake tube, to prevent
> the fluid from all siphoning out. For a set of _male_ plugs,
> I cut the brake tube flush with the male nut, and brazed
> it closed. I snug the plugs down with a pair of wrenches.
>
> These bunch of male nuts and female nuts come in
> very handy when disconnecting the brake system.
>
> A person could probably do the same thing with a propane
> torch, some plumbers solder and flux. Steel wool etc. the
> metal bright and shiny, apply flux and solder. Don't cut the
> tube flush... leave some sticking out and solder the tube
> closed.
>
>
> >
> > --
> > Tegger
> >
> > The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
> > www.tegger.com/hondafaq/
>
>

The m/c kit I bought from Autozone came with all sorts of plugs and hoses
I needed.