Honda Car Forum

Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:

> In article <tZWdnay8U4UzV53VnZ2dnUVZ_j-dnZ2d@speakeasy.net>,
> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>
>
>>>But then, if it has a good additive package to keep the engine clean
>>>(that's what Top Tier is really all about) and the fuel cost per mile is
>>>no more than Shell
>>
>>that depends on calorie content. and the only way the layperson can get
>>any handle on that is to keep accurate records of consumption over the
>>same route in long term testing - just like you say.
>
>
> yep. Although, given that it's regularly 15 cents/gallon cheaper than
> other gas, I don't think I'd waste my time spending a few months
> tracking the Hess gas cost/mile.
>
> There's a reason it's cheaper. The fuel company in question has made a
> marketing decision to appeal to those too dumb to understand anything
> beyond "look, it costs 15 cents/gallon less to buy!".
>


An interesting note on Hess...

I attended the national Studebaker meet in South Bend, Indiana in 2002
when average fuel prices were around $1.20 per gallon. At the time, a
gas war in South Bend had prices closer to $1 per gallon and at the end
of the meet I decided to fill up before going on the RI.

Well, the gas war had ended and prices were in the mid $1.20 range
except for Hess which was around $1.10. As I drove by, the line at Hess
was too long so I just paid the higher price a little further down the road.

When I returned to Texas, I read of the woes of many meet attendees who
had serious fuel problems with the Hess gas.

Sometimes cheepah ain't bettah...

JT

On Fri, 11 Apr 2008 22:56:21 -0400, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:

>In article <f21004hduf69h5smmr9p4oceh97326cq2e@4ax.com>,
> nick@nowhere.com wrote:
>
>> >> Would you consider QuikTrip equal to Shell??
>> >
>> >Not without knowing more about it.
>> >
>> >But then, if it has a good additive package to keep the engine clean
>> >(that's what Top Tier is really all about) and the fuel cost per mile is
>> >no more than Shell, I'd have no beef with it.
>>
>> I've been using Hess gas for 10+ years and have not noticed any
>> difference from that, then any other major vendor Sunoco, Shell or
>> Exxon.
>
>You wouldn't, unless you actually compared it to Shell.
>
>If you do, you'll see the difference. You'll see that the cheap gas (15
>cents/gal less?) isn't keeping your engine clean and costs more per mile
>to run, regardless.


Well unfortunately the closest Shell that I have is about 20 miles
away so that rules out being convenient for me to get it. I have tried
it and noticed no difference in the way the car reacts. I have also
tried Exxon, Lukoil and Sunoco, still no difference. It almost
impossible to compare fuel cost per mile to say one is better than the
other. There are too many variables to be able to get any accurate
count on this.

In article <jdf204h6jk4hd8ema8h7nh3u6tutto6eq7@4ax.com>,
nick@nowhere.com wrote:

> >> I've been using Hess gas for 10+ years and have not noticed any
> >> difference from that, then any other major vendor Sunoco, Shell or
> >> Exxon.
> >
> >You wouldn't, unless you actually compared it to Shell.
> >
> >If you do, you'll see the difference. You'll see that the cheap gas (15
> >cents/gal less?) isn't keeping your engine clean and costs more per mile
> >to run, regardless.
>
>
> Well unfortunately the closest Shell that I have is about 20 miles
> away so that rules out being convenient for me to get it. I have tried
> it and noticed no difference in the way the car reacts. I have also
> tried Exxon, Lukoil and Sunoco, still no difference.

You won't tell on one tank of gas. You won't be able to tell anything.
Not on one tank.



> It almost
> impossible to compare fuel cost per mile to say one is better than the
> other.

No it's not. Why do you say that?



> There are too many variables to be able to get any accurate
> count on this.

If you do it over several months, most if not all of the variables come
out in the wash. If several people drive the car, if you drive it under
several conditions, so what? Over several months you'll do the same
thing for both gasoline tests.

Best to run the grocery store gas first and get that out of the way,
then run Shell or another top tier gas for 6 months.

I think you'd be amazed.

On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 20:25:21 -0400, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:

>In article <jdf204h6jk4hd8ema8h7nh3u6tutto6eq7@4ax.com>,
> nick@nowhere.com wrote:
>
>> >> I've been using Hess gas for 10+ years and have not noticed any
>> >> difference from that, then any other major vendor Sunoco, Shell or
>> >> Exxon.
>> >
>> >You wouldn't, unless you actually compared it to Shell.
>> >
>> >If you do, you'll see the difference. You'll see that the cheap gas (15
>> >cents/gal less?) isn't keeping your engine clean and costs more per mile
>> >to run, regardless.
>>
>>
>> Well unfortunately the closest Shell that I have is about 20 miles
>> away so that rules out being convenient for me to get it. I have tried
>> it and noticed no difference in the way the car reacts. I have also
>> tried Exxon, Lukoil and Sunoco, still no difference.
>
>You won't tell on one tank of gas. You won't be able to tell anything.
>Not on one tank.
>
>
>
>> It almost
>> impossible to compare fuel cost per mile to say one is better than the
>> other.
>
>No it's not. Why do you say that?

Well for one you won't travel the same road, at the same speed, at the
same rpms for two consecutive tanks. That also doesn't factor even how
many lights you stop and for how long.


>
>
>
>> There are too many variables to be able to get any accurate
>> count on this.
>
>If you do it over several months, most if not all of the variables come
>out in the wash. If several people drive the car, if you drive it under
>several conditions, so what? Over several months you'll do the same
>thing for both gasoline tests.
>
>Best to run the grocery store gas first and get that out of the way,
>then run Shell or another top tier gas for 6 months.
>
>I think you'd be amazed.

In article <ssu2049q556fif6ombir7ron4i6am4vvdj@4ax.com>,
Nick@nowhere.com wrote:

> >> impossible to compare fuel cost per mile to say one is better than the
> >> other.
> >
> >No it's not. Why do you say that?
>
> Well for one you won't travel the same road, at the same speed, at the
> same rpms for two consecutive tanks. That also doesn't factor even how
> many lights you stop and for how long.

Did you read what I then said? It all comes out in the wash if you do
it over several months.

On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 05:03:36 -0400, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:

>In article <ssu2049q556fif6ombir7ron4i6am4vvdj@4ax.com>,
> Nick@nowhere.com wrote:
>
>> >> impossible to compare fuel cost per mile to say one is better than the
>> >> other.
>> >
>> >No it's not. Why do you say that?
>>
>> Well for one you won't travel the same road, at the same speed, at the
>> same rpms for two consecutive tanks. That also doesn't factor even how
>> many lights you stop and for how long.
>
>Did you read what I then said? It all comes out in the wash if you do
>it over several months.

There is nothing on that website to prove your claim.

In article <gu2404tln6597kjrul6ci5vhjdor9jo5pb@4ax.com>,
nick@nowhere.com wrote:

> >> >> impossible to compare fuel cost per mile to say one is better than the
> >> >> other.
> >> >
> >> >No it's not. Why do you say that?
> >>
> >> Well for one you won't travel the same road, at the same speed, at the
> >> same rpms for two consecutive tanks. That also doesn't factor even how
> >> many lights you stop and for how long.
> >
> >Did you read what I then said? It all comes out in the wash if you do
> >it over several months.
>
> There is nothing on that website to prove your claim.

I didn't say there was. When did I say that? Can you quote me?

I personally did the testing, on my own, older car. Shell gas costs
less to run, per mile, than grocery store gas.

Further, you plainly know nothing about testing something like this.
Over one tank, your observations are valid. Over several months, you
drive the car the same way on average.

I have an unmodified 2004 Accord EX-L sedan 5-spd 4-cyl, purchased new
four years ago, now with 51K. Car is used primarily in suburban area
(75%) of northeastern U.S. with about 25% highway use. Rarely driven
in snow, but used as a daily driver.

I used CarCare software to keep meticulous track of MPG at every fill-
up (only full fill-ups) by brand of gas.

Here's the average track record for my Accord (four-years worth of
data):

Amoco / BP : 246 gallons total / 6792 miles traveled / 33 fill-
ups / average of $2.46 per gallon / 27.63 avg MPG
Exxon : 716 gallons total / 17,661 miles traveled / 91
fill-ups / average of $2.38 per gallon / 24.66 avg MPG
Hess : 26 gallons total / 649 miles traveled / 4
fill-ups / average of $2.82 per gallon / 25.09 avg MPG
Shell : 65 gallons total / 1729 miles traveled / 7
fill-ups / average of $2.08 per gallon / 26.47 avg MPG
Sunoco : 520 gallons total / 15,626 miles traveled / 73
fill-ups / average of $2.65 per gallon / 30.07 avg MPG

I believe I used the Shell brand early in the car's life, as the
average gas prices were quite low in the U.S.

I don't think I should rely on my Hess data, because it's
statistically not significant here.

there are a lot of QuikTrip (QT) stations in Dallas area. It is rated as
Tier 1.

But I wonder if it is as good as Shell, Exxon, or other 'majors'.

Also a lot of RaceTrac stations here but I didn't see RaceTrac listed as
Tier 1.
"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
news:elmop-18BB3B.21262310042008@nntp2.usenetserver.com...
In article <NLwLj.65597$y05.41608@newsfe22.lga>,
"alfred" <tomboy83=@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I know this is going to sound like a dumb question, but does anyone
> recommend or not recommend the use of Hess brand gasoline in Hondas, such
> as
> a new Honda Accord? The Hess gas is 10-15 cents less per gallon than shell
> in my area.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Al

It's not about the price to fill the tank.

It's about the cost per mile.

Run with Hess for a few months, and calculate your cost per mile.

Then run with Shell for a few months. Start with several tanks of their
93 octane (V-Power) to clean out all the crap and crud that resulted
from your using Hess, then go back to 87 octane and start measuring your
cost per mile for Shell gas.

It is possible to spend less to fill up the tank but more to drive each
mile. And it's very likely that's what will happen.

And, of course, there's the costs down the road. There's a reason Shell
is one of Honda's recommended gasoline vendors
(http://www.toptiergas.com).

Yeah, the Hess gas costs less for the same reason the McD's hamburger
costs less than the steak at Ruth's Chris.