Honda Car Forum

Tegger wrote:
> nick@nowhere.com wrote in news:tg5nf3tdgesmgg9keq3lb2n2l3uhsv0kf9@4ax.com:
>
>> Thanks Andy,
>>
>> I'm going to try that route first and get a new oil filter. If
>> that fails then I'll try the liquid gasket.
>
>
>
> Do NOT use liquid gasket on your oil filter flange!!!!!!! That not only
> won't work but may cause grave damage to your engine if you get any of it
> in the "clean" side of the filter.

here's the deal on that though - you're only supposed to use a smear
that will fill any crack or scratch. maybe i should have been more
explicit about that. i've never has a problem with liquid gasket in
this way, but i never splurge this stuff about.

silicone sealants otoh can be a problem, and this is something i've
encountered repairing other people's work on many an occasion. unless
the metal is absolutely clean, no oil films, then the silicone doesn't
stick and tends to end up floating about in the system and clogging
stuff. they're fine if they're squeezed tight and the seal isn't
broken, but once they're broken and bits can flake off, that's when the
problem starts.


>
> IF in fact the filter is to blame, find out why. Don't band-aid the problem
> with something that will certainly cause you more trouble in the future
> (and make the pro's laugh at you behind your back when you eventually
> surrender to them).
>
> You need to be 100% certain the leak is coming from the filter, not "85%
> certain". Because of air turbulence in the engine compartment, oil leak
> sources are easily obscured as oil whips around as you drive.
>
> Change the filter with a new dealer filter. Wipe the area well that
> surrounds the filter mount boss. Put a /very light/ film of oil on the new
> filter gasket. Install to 8-10 ft lbs, but NO TIGHTER. With the car still
> raised, start the engine and let it idle until the engine is at operating
> temperature (about 10-15 minutes). If the filter is in fact leaking, oil
> will squeeze past the gasket and form a droplet at the bottom of the
> filter. If no droplet ever forms, then it's not your filter that's leaking.
>
> Your leak is more likely to be coming from the valve cover gasket, the
> front balance shaft seal, or a cracked exhaust manifold bracket boss (the
> last two are known issues on your car).
>
> The thing to do is to get the block steam cleaned (by your dealer, not
> you), then sprayed with aerosol leak detection powder. A short drive should
> then pinpoint the source of the leak.
>
> I'm betting it's the valve cover gasket, myself.
>
>
>

jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
newsMSdnUd866Eh_mHbnZ2dnUVZ_qmlnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:

> Tegger wrote:
>> nick@nowhere.com wrote in
>> news:tg5nf3tdgesmgg9keq3lb2n2l3uhsv0kf9@4ax.com:
>>
>>> Thanks Andy,
>>>
>>> I'm going to try that route first and get a new oil filter. If
>>> that fails then I'll try the liquid gasket.
>>
>>
>>
>> Do NOT use liquid gasket on your oil filter flange!!!!!!! That not
>> only won't work but may cause grave damage to your engine if you get
>> any of it in the "clean" side of the filter.
>
> here's the deal on that though - you're only supposed to use a smear
> that will fill any crack or scratch. maybe i should have been more
> explicit about that. i've never has a problem with liquid gasket in
> this way, but i never splurge this stuff about.



The point is that sealing potions should never be needed. If there /is/ an
apparent need for such stuff, then something else is wrong. The oil filter
will seal itself properly every time if correctly installed.



>
> silicone sealants otoh can be a problem, and this is something i've
> encountered repairing other people's work on many an occasion. unless
> the metal is absolutely clean, no oil films, then the silicone doesn't
> stick and tends to end up floating about in the system and clogging
> stuff. they're fine if they're squeezed tight and the seal isn't
> broken, but once they're broken and bits can flake off, that's when
> the problem starts.



Silicone is even worse. Oxygen sensors (especially today's multiple $400
sensors) do not like silicone at all.



--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Tegger wrote:
> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
> newsMSdnUd866Eh_mHbnZ2dnUVZ_qmlnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>
>> Tegger wrote:
>>> nick@nowhere.com wrote in
>>> news:tg5nf3tdgesmgg9keq3lb2n2l3uhsv0kf9@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> Thanks Andy,
>>>>
>>>> I'm going to try that route first and get a new oil filter. If
>>>> that fails then I'll try the liquid gasket.
>>>
>>>
>>> Do NOT use liquid gasket on your oil filter flange!!!!!!! That not
>>> only won't work but may cause grave damage to your engine if you get
>>> any of it in the "clean" side of the filter.
>> here's the deal on that though - you're only supposed to use a smear
>> that will fill any crack or scratch. maybe i should have been more
>> explicit about that. i've never has a problem with liquid gasket in
>> this way, but i never splurge this stuff about.
>
>
>
> The point is that sealing potions should never be needed.

that depends where - it's regarded as essential in locations such as the
rocker cover corners and the oil pan corners because it gets into the
crevices...


> If there /is/ an
> apparent need for such stuff, then something else is wrong.

indeed - if there is a leak where there shouldn't be a leak, then
something /is/ wrong. especially in a location that is normally ok like
this.


> The oil filter
> will seal itself properly every time if correctly installed.

indeed. unless something's wrong. do i assign a high probability to it
being a problem with the seal mating surface? no. /much/ more likely
it's a problem as i described earlier. but if for some bizarre reason,
say a slipped wrench causing a small gouge on the seal interface, i
stand by my recommendation because other than re-machining, there really
is no other solution.


>
>
>
>> silicone sealants otoh can be a problem, and this is something i've
>> encountered repairing other people's work on many an occasion. unless
>> the metal is absolutely clean, no oil films, then the silicone doesn't
>> stick and tends to end up floating about in the system and clogging
>> stuff. they're fine if they're squeezed tight and the seal isn't
>> broken, but once they're broken and bits can flake off, that's when
>> the problem starts.
>
>
>
> Silicone is even worse. Oxygen sensors (especially today's multiple $400
> sensors) do not like silicone at all.

if it gets into the fuel delivery system. gasket silicone doesn't do
that. it's where people habitually spray liquid silicone lube on
throttle bodies that there's a problem.

jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
news:NpKdnauoB6Dma2HbnZ2dnUVZ_gudnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:


>
> if it gets into the fuel delivery system. gasket silicone doesn't do
> that. it's where people habitually spray liquid silicone lube on
> throttle bodies that there's a problem.
>


Silicone is deadly to oxygen sensors no matter where it's applied to the
engine. You must use the "sensor safe" stuff, which not everybody is going
to know about.

I still think it's a poor idea to advise anybody to use goop as a band-aid
fix for a problem that is poorly understood in the first place, which is
what's happening in this case.

--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Tegger wrote:
> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
> news:NpKdnauoB6Dma2HbnZ2dnUVZ_gudnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>
>
>> if it gets into the fuel delivery system. gasket silicone doesn't do
>> that. it's where people habitually spray liquid silicone lube on
>> throttle bodies that there's a problem.
>>
>
>
> Silicone is deadly to oxygen sensors no matter where it's applied to the
> engine.

sorry dude, that's untrue. silicone rubber is perfectly kosher as a
sealant on all kinds of engine systems, and most definitely on the oil
side of the combustion process - it's used extensively by oem manufacturers.

> You must use the "sensor safe" stuff, which not everybody is going
> to know about.

solid silicone rubber /is/ "sensor safe", regardless of the marketing
differentiation. look at the msds of any of the typical silicone gasket
rubbers and they're all pretty much identical.


>
> I still think it's a poor idea to advise anybody to use goop as a band-aid
> fix for a problem that is poorly understood in the first place, which is
> what's happening in this case.

i agree that we know almost nothing about the op's condition - that's
why i advised closer inspection. but if it's not the filter and it's
not simply crud, then suddenly it's a whole different game. remachining
a damaged interface is impracticable. so what's next? solid silicone
on an interface that's going to be re-made every time the filer changes
isn't going to work.

I've replaced the oil filter today with a Puralator Plus since
the size is the same diameter as the old Honda OEM filters. I'll
report back tomorrow if it is still leaking.

Thanks,
Nick


On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 07:05:52 -0700, jim beam
<spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:

>Tegger wrote:
>> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
>> news:NpKdnauoB6Dma2HbnZ2dnUVZ_gudnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>>
>>
>>> if it gets into the fuel delivery system. gasket silicone doesn't do
>>> that. it's where people habitually spray liquid silicone lube on
>>> throttle bodies that there's a problem.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Silicone is deadly to oxygen sensors no matter where it's applied to the
>> engine.
>
>sorry dude, that's untrue. silicone rubber is perfectly kosher as a
>sealant on all kinds of engine systems, and most definitely on the oil
>side of the combustion process - it's used extensively by oem manufacturers.
>
>> You must use the "sensor safe" stuff, which not everybody is going
>> to know about.
>
>solid silicone rubber /is/ "sensor safe", regardless of the marketing
>differentiation. look at the msds of any of the typical silicone gasket
>rubbers and they're all pretty much identical.
>
>
>>
>> I still think it's a poor idea to advise anybody to use goop as a band-aid
>> fix for a problem that is poorly understood in the first place, which is
>> what's happening in this case.
>
>i agree that we know almost nothing about the op's condition - that's
>why i advised closer inspection. but if it's not the filter and it's
>not simply crud, then suddenly it's a whole different game. remachining
>a damaged interface is impracticable. so what's next? solid silicone
>on an interface that's going to be re-made every time the filer changes
>isn't going to work.

Ok after investigating the issue further, it appears that the leak is
coming from a hose with a wire inside of it just below the intake
manifold. It looks like it goes into a cover with a bunch of wires
hidden inside of that. Does anyone know what part this is? Is this
something that I can easily fix with a lift?

Thanks,
Nick


On Sat, 29 Sep 2007 21:22:45 -0400, nick@nowhere.com wrote:

> I've replaced the oil filter today with a Puralator Plus since
>the size is the same diameter as the old Honda OEM filters. I'll
>report back tomorrow if it is still leaking.
>
>Thanks,
>Nick
>
>
>On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 07:05:52 -0700, jim beam
><spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>
>>Tegger wrote:
>>> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
>>> news:NpKdnauoB6Dma2HbnZ2dnUVZ_gudnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>>>
>>>
>>>> if it gets into the fuel delivery system. gasket silicone doesn't do
>>>> that. it's where people habitually spray liquid silicone lube on
>>>> throttle bodies that there's a problem.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Silicone is deadly to oxygen sensors no matter where it's applied to the
>>> engine.
>>
>>sorry dude, that's untrue. silicone rubber is perfectly kosher as a
>>sealant on all kinds of engine systems, and most definitely on the oil
>>side of the combustion process - it's used extensively by oem manufacturers.
>>
>>> You must use the "sensor safe" stuff, which not everybody is going
>>> to know about.
>>
>>solid silicone rubber /is/ "sensor safe", regardless of the marketing
>>differentiation. look at the msds of any of the typical silicone gasket
>>rubbers and they're all pretty much identical.
>>
>>
>>>
>>> I still think it's a poor idea to advise anybody to use goop as a band-aid
>>> fix for a problem that is poorly understood in the first place, which is
>>> what's happening in this case.
>>
>>i agree that we know almost nothing about the op's condition - that's
>>why i advised closer inspection. but if it's not the filter and it's
>>not simply crud, then suddenly it's a whole different game. remachining
>>a damaged interface is impracticable. so what's next? solid silicone
>>on an interface that's going to be re-made every time the filer changes
>>isn't going to work.

nick@nowhere.com wrote:
> Ok after investigating the issue further, it appears that the leak is
> coming from a hose with a wire inside of it just below the intake
> manifold. It looks like it goes into a cover with a bunch of wires
> hidden inside of that. Does anyone know what part this is?

sounds like the oil pressure switch. they go frequently on some cars -
not so much honda. check for tightness first. if it's already tight,
just replace it and you'll be fine after that.


> Is this
> something that I can easily fix with a lift?

just reach up there with a deep socket of the right size. can't recall
right now, but it's metric. buy a new switch from honda - don't mess
with after-market crap.


>
> Thanks,
> Nick
>
>
> On Sat, 29 Sep 2007 21:22:45 -0400, nick@nowhere.com wrote:
>
>> I've replaced the oil filter today with a Puralator Plus since
>> the size is the same diameter as the old Honda OEM filters. I'll
>> report back tomorrow if it is still leaking.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Nick
>>
>>
>> On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 07:05:52 -0700, jim beam
>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Tegger wrote:
>>>> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
>>>> news:NpKdnauoB6Dma2HbnZ2dnUVZ_gudnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> if it gets into the fuel delivery system. gasket silicone doesn't do
>>>>> that. it's where people habitually spray liquid silicone lube on
>>>>> throttle bodies that there's a problem.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Silicone is deadly to oxygen sensors no matter where it's applied to the
>>>> engine.
>>> sorry dude, that's untrue. silicone rubber is perfectly kosher as a
>>> sealant on all kinds of engine systems, and most definitely on the oil
>>> side of the combustion process - it's used extensively by oem manufacturers.
>>>
>>>> You must use the "sensor safe" stuff, which not everybody is going
>>>> to know about.
>>> solid silicone rubber /is/ "sensor safe", regardless of the marketing
>>> differentiation. look at the msds of any of the typical silicone gasket
>>> rubbers and they're all pretty much identical.
>>>
>>>
>>>> I still think it's a poor idea to advise anybody to use goop as a band-aid
>>>> fix for a problem that is poorly understood in the first place, which is
>>>> what's happening in this case.
>>> i agree that we know almost nothing about the op's condition - that's
>>> why i advised closer inspection. but if it's not the filter and it's
>>> not simply crud, then suddenly it's a whole different game. remachining
>>> a damaged interface is impracticable. so what's next? solid silicone
>>> on an interface that's going to be re-made every time the filer changes
>>> isn't going to work.

Ok Jim thanks for the help. I looked at my Helms manual and sure
enough that is the part. I'm assuming that the wire is disconnected at
the point where it comes out of the engine block? Also the plastic
shield has cracked in one section should I be concerned, can I shield
it with electrical tape?

Thanks again for the help

Nick


On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 12:21:21 -0700, jim beam
<spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:

>nick@nowhere.com wrote:
>> Ok after investigating the issue further, it appears that the leak is
>> coming from a hose with a wire inside of it just below the intake
>> manifold. It looks like it goes into a cover with a bunch of wires
>> hidden inside of that. Does anyone know what part this is?
>
>sounds like the oil pressure switch. they go frequently on some cars -
>not so much honda. check for tightness first. if it's already tight,
>just replace it and you'll be fine after that.
>
>
>> Is this
>> something that I can easily fix with a lift?
>
>just reach up there with a deep socket of the right size. can't recall
>right now, but it's metric. buy a new switch from honda - don't mess
>with after-market crap.
>
>
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Nick
>>
>>
>> On Sat, 29 Sep 2007 21:22:45 -0400, nick@nowhere.com wrote:
>>
>>> I've replaced the oil filter today with a Puralator Plus since
>>> the size is the same diameter as the old Honda OEM filters. I'll
>>> report back tomorrow if it is still leaking.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Nick
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 07:05:52 -0700, jim beam
>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Tegger wrote:
>>>>> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
>>>>> news:NpKdnauoB6Dma2HbnZ2dnUVZ_gudnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> if it gets into the fuel delivery system. gasket silicone doesn't do
>>>>>> that. it's where people habitually spray liquid silicone lube on
>>>>>> throttle bodies that there's a problem.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Silicone is deadly to oxygen sensors no matter where it's applied to the
>>>>> engine.
>>>> sorry dude, that's untrue. silicone rubber is perfectly kosher as a
>>>> sealant on all kinds of engine systems, and most definitely on the oil
>>>> side of the combustion process - it's used extensively by oem manufacturers.
>>>>
>>>>> You must use the "sensor safe" stuff, which not everybody is going
>>>>> to know about.
>>>> solid silicone rubber /is/ "sensor safe", regardless of the marketing
>>>> differentiation. look at the msds of any of the typical silicone gasket
>>>> rubbers and they're all pretty much identical.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I still think it's a poor idea to advise anybody to use goop as a band-aid
>>>>> fix for a problem that is poorly understood in the first place, which is
>>>>> what's happening in this case.
>>>> i agree that we know almost nothing about the op's condition - that's
>>>> why i advised closer inspection. but if it's not the filter and it's
>>>> not simply crud, then suddenly it's a whole different game. remachining
>>>> a damaged interface is impracticable. so what's next? solid silicone
>>>> on an interface that's going to be re-made every time the filer changes
>>>> isn't going to work.

nick@nowhere.com wrote:
> Ok Jim thanks for the help. I looked at my Helms manual and sure
> enough that is the part. I'm assuming that the wire is disconnected at
> the point where it comes out of the engine block?

yes, the wires go into a snap connector, and the whole connector unplugs
from the switch. like most honda connectors, there's a tab you need to
squeeze to release the retaining hook when unplugging.

> Also the plastic
> shield has cracked in one section should I be concerned, can I shield
> it with electrical tape?

yes. don't want it too tight though - the wires need to flex a bit.


>
> Thanks again for the help

you're welcome. for the future, consider purchase of the factory
service manual from helminc.com. haynes is terrible.


>
> Nick
>
>
> On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 12:21:21 -0700, jim beam
> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>
>> nick@nowhere.com wrote:
>>> Ok after investigating the issue further, it appears that the leak is
>>> coming from a hose with a wire inside of it just below the intake
>>> manifold. It looks like it goes into a cover with a bunch of wires
>>> hidden inside of that. Does anyone know what part this is?
>> sounds like the oil pressure switch. they go frequently on some cars -
>> not so much honda. check for tightness first. if it's already tight,
>> just replace it and you'll be fine after that.
>>
>>
>>> Is this
>>> something that I can easily fix with a lift?
>> just reach up there with a deep socket of the right size. can't recall
>> right now, but it's metric. buy a new switch from honda - don't mess
>> with after-market crap.
>>
>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Nick
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, 29 Sep 2007 21:22:45 -0400, nick@nowhere.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've replaced the oil filter today with a Puralator Plus since
>>>> the size is the same diameter as the old Honda OEM filters. I'll
>>>> report back tomorrow if it is still leaking.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Nick
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 07:05:52 -0700, jim beam
>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Tegger wrote:
>>>>>> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
>>>>>> news:NpKdnauoB6Dma2HbnZ2dnUVZ_gudnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> if it gets into the fuel delivery system. gasket silicone doesn't do
>>>>>>> that. it's where people habitually spray liquid silicone lube on
>>>>>>> throttle bodies that there's a problem.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Silicone is deadly to oxygen sensors no matter where it's applied to the
>>>>>> engine.
>>>>> sorry dude, that's untrue. silicone rubber is perfectly kosher as a
>>>>> sealant on all kinds of engine systems, and most definitely on the oil
>>>>> side of the combustion process - it's used extensively by oem manufacturers.
>>>>>
>>>>>> You must use the "sensor safe" stuff, which not everybody is going
>>>>>> to know about.
>>>>> solid silicone rubber /is/ "sensor safe", regardless of the marketing
>>>>> differentiation. look at the msds of any of the typical silicone gasket
>>>>> rubbers and they're all pretty much identical.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> I still think it's a poor idea to advise anybody to use goop as a band-aid
>>>>>> fix for a problem that is poorly understood in the first place, which is
>>>>>> what's happening in this case.
>>>>> i agree that we know almost nothing about the op's condition - that's
>>>>> why i advised closer inspection. but if it's not the filter and it's
>>>>> not simply crud, then suddenly it's a whole different game. remachining
>>>>> a damaged interface is impracticable. so what's next? solid silicone
>>>>> on an interface that's going to be re-made every time the filer changes
>>>>> isn't going to work.