Honda Car Forum

I have an extremely nice 1990 Civic DX 4-door 5-speed 1.5L with about 135K
miles. The rear trailing arm bushings (the big ones) are squeaking/creaking
and I'm contemplating a little suspension work. So ...

Should I go through the entire front and rear suspensions and replace ALL
the rubber items plus upper and lower ball joints? The job really doesn't
worry assuming I can get my hands on the proper tools.

What about those upper ball joints? Do they ever really go bad or not?
Would I be better off purchasing the upper a-arm assembly (that price looks
good when one considers the bushings and potential ball joint)?

Should I only replace the "main" bushings? What qualifies as "main"? Only
the big ones in the rear and only the two per side on the long lower arm?
More? What ones?

Are there any special tips/tricks I should know? I want to restore the
factory ride, handling and noise level (I'm not going to poly bushings!) and
would plan on purchasing genuine Honda parts. Is there anything I should
consider doing different ... different bushings in certain areas ...
whatever, but again, noise and ride quality are the top priorities ... this
won't be a race car for a long time ... if ever :-)

Now ... about those tools ...

I've seen a really neat tool for the rear trailing arm bushings from Schley.
What else is needed?

Can these be rented/borrowed from anywhere? Does the typical Auto Zone have
the required tools? Other sources? Or do I just have to really consider
buying a few tools.

Thanks a ton for any info!

Dave
'90 Civic - extremely nice
'91 Civic - beater
'89 Mustang GT

Dave Wick wrote:
> I have an extremely nice 1990 Civic DX 4-door 5-speed 1.5L with about 135K
> miles. The rear trailing arm bushings (the big ones) are squeaking/creaking
> and I'm contemplating a little suspension work. So ...

are you sure it's the bushings and not the springs?

>
> Should I go through the entire front and rear suspensions and replace ALL
> the rubber items plus upper and lower ball joints?

how much time and money do you want to spend? i've replaced all the
bushings in my civics over the years, and by far the most important are
the big ones in the lower rear trailing arms.

> The job really doesn't
> worry assuming I can get my hands on the proper tools.
>
> What about those upper ball joints? Do they ever really go bad or not?

absolutely. depends how you drive. if you corner hard, they tend to go
sooner.

> Would I be better off purchasing the upper a-arm assembly (that price looks
> good when one considers the bushings and potential ball joint)?

that's the only "honda" choice you get. any other ball joint-only
solution is after-market.

>
> Should I only replace the "main" bushings? What qualifies as "main"? Only
> the big ones in the rear and only the two per side on the long lower arm?
> More? What ones?

see above.

>
> Are there any special tips/tricks I should know? I want to restore the
> factory ride, handling and noise level (I'm not going to poly bushings!) and
> would plan on purchasing genuine Honda parts. Is there anything I should
> consider doing different ... different bushings in certain areas ...
> whatever, but again, noise and ride quality are the top priorities ... this
> won't be a race car for a long time ... if ever :-)

factory is good enough. king motor sports sell mugen bushings which are
genuine honda spec, only with a harder rubber for racing. they're top
quality and don't squeak like urethane, /but/ they can make the ride a
little harsh for some tastes - like mine.

>
> Now ... about those tools ...
>
> I've seen a really neat tool for the rear trailing arm bushings from Schley.
> What else is needed?

ball joint separator.
http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/disconnect.html

also, penetrating oil and maybe replacement bolts if there's rust

>
> Can these be rented/borrowed from anywhere? Does the typical Auto Zone have
> the required tools? Other sources? Or do I just have to really consider
> buying a few tools.
>
> Thanks a ton for any info!
>
> Dave
> '90 Civic - extremely nice
> '91 Civic - beater
> '89 Mustang GT
>
>
>
>

Well, I did exactly that job on my 92' Si a couple of years ago. I opted
only for rubber parts, and I replaced all rubber parts. It runs much
more stable since.

Surprisingly, big bushings were not a problem at all - I easily pressed
them out with a sledge, and the new ones easily slipped in under the
light hammer hits after spending a few hours in the freezer.

Lower arm I had to outsource to the shop with 20 ton press, and this
was barely enough.

The real problem were upper and compensator arm, because of seized
bolts. I had to use grinder and sabre saw to get those parts out, and I
ruined them in the process – so I had to get the new ones.

Hope this helps.


--
MishaA
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"Dave Wick" <davewick@new.rr.com> wrote in
news:1o7bh.295$xC4.208@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com:

> I have an extremely nice 1990 Civic DX 4-door 5-speed 1.5L with about
> 135K miles. The rear trailing arm bushings (the big ones) are
> squeaking/creaking and I'm contemplating a little suspension work. So
> ...
>
> Should I go through the entire front and rear suspensions and replace
> ALL the rubber items plus upper and lower ball joints? The job really
> doesn't worry assuming I can get my hands on the proper tools.
>
> What about those upper ball joints? Do they ever really go bad or not?
> Would I be better off purchasing the upper a-arm assembly (that price
> looks good when one considers the bushings and potential ball joint)?
>
> Should I only replace the "main" bushings? What qualifies as "main"?
> Only the big ones in the rear and only the two per side on the long
> lower arm? More? What ones?
>
> Are there any special tips/tricks I should know? I want to restore
> the factory ride, handling and noise level (I'm not going to poly
> bushings!) and would plan on purchasing genuine Honda parts. Is there
> anything I should consider doing different ... different bushings in
> certain areas ... whatever, but again, noise and ride quality are the
> top priorities ... this won't be a race car for a long time ... if
> ever :-)
>
> Now ... about those tools ...
>
> I've seen a really neat tool for the rear trailing arm bushings from
> Schley. What else is needed?
>
> Can these be rented/borrowed from anywhere? Does the typical Auto
> Zone have the required tools? Other sources? Or do I just have to
> really consider buying a few tools.
>



I had trouble deciding what to snip off this post, and ended up leaving it
as-is.

First off, dont expect a world of difference in handling. If you want to
restore the factory ride, you need to replace the shocks as well, and you
will find they are extremely expensive unless you buy aftermarket. I left
mine in place, as they weren't leaking. I figured $200 a pop wasn't worth
it.

I've done every single bushing on my '91 Integra over the last two summers.
Every bushing was replaced with OEM. If you decide to do this, be prepared
for some serious expenditure. I spent about $1500 all told, including
paying garages to do the actual pressing.

A proper balljoint tool is essential. An electric impact wrench is
essential. Without those two, your life will be a living hell for days. You
can rent both items. If not from AZ, then from an industrial supply house.

Just remember to put the balljoint's castle nut back on upside down BEFORE
you start pressing on it!

Don't kid yourself that you'll be able to press the old bushings out
yourself. Not with any sort of ease, anyway. Elle struggled for a long time
with hers. I didn't bother. Having a garage press out/in the bushings on
the rear cost me $250. The fronts were far simpler, costing me $30. I don't
regret spending the money. It saved me tons of time. Apparently the Schley
tool does work well for the big trailing arm bushing, though.

If your car has rear drum brakes, you'll want to avoid having to open up
the hydraulics. When Elle did her trailing arm bushings a while back, she
used the Schley tool you mention, with good success. If your car has discs
on the rear, you can remove the trailing arm without disconnecting the
hydraulics.

You will very likely suffer some seriously seized fasteners at the rear. If
so, you will get absolutely nowhere unless you have a DeWalt DW-293
electric impact wrench. And if that doesn't work, it's an angle grinder or
nothing. All the front fasteners must be replaced, not reused. The rears
can be reused.

The balljoints are trivially easy with the right tool, but only for
disconnecting them from the lower control arm. The lowers will have to be
pressed out by a garage - with the knuckle OFF the car, which is a lot of
work. The upper balljoint is only available OEM as part of the upper A-arm.
And it's expensive.


Some Google Groups links here:
http://tinyurl.com/yglqw8
http://tinyurl.com/ylojhm
http://tinyurl.com/ymmjjl

and from my site
http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/misc/new_front_bushings/
http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/misc/old-bushings/
http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/disconnect.html

and more Google Groups
http://tinyurl.com/yzhcyn

Good luck.

--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Dave,

I replaced all the front lower control arm bushings and all
of the rear bushings on my 91 Civic this past summer. What
Tegger said about my labor in pressing out the lower control
arm bushings "by hand" is true. It can be done but it is
/very/ labor intensive for an athletic woman. A man in
half-decent shape will fare better without question, but one
also has to be clever. OTOH, if you have access to a 20-ton
shop press, this should be fine for pressing the old lower
control arm bushings out and pushing the new ones in. But no
guarantees on this. Those bushings really freeze up after a
decade or so! See the newsgroup archives for reports on many
who simply found a shop that pressed the control arm
bushings in and out for a reasonable fee, albeit more than a
few reported that the shop also admitted to having a lot of
trouble pressing them in and out. The shop has to have a
humongous press.

I also agree with most everything else Tegger says.

On the poly bushings: I decided not to go with them, because
of the many reports of noise problems and some opinions that
the ride was stiffer. I bought all bushings from online OEM
parts sites.

For the trailing arm bushings, I found that shops hesitated
to agree to press them out. Also, some folks have had
problems getting the shop to orient the bushings correctly.
I got estimates on the job from both Pep Boys and my local
Honda dealer, and found I would save a bundle if I bought
the tool and bushings myself. I found the tool new on Ebay
for $139 total, but I do not currently see it there.

I hesitated to do more suspension work (e.g. ball joints),
because I did not have evidence that they were failing. Plus
I plan to keep the car only "another five years." I think my
ride is smoother, but not by much.

I did replace the stabilizer links in their entirety. Their
rubber bushings were really shot, and on one, the steel was
eaten away. They're an easy job.

My site has a full report on all this, plus links to other
sites discussing these jobs. See
http://home.earthlink.net/~honda.lioness/id15.html

Found one of the Schley "trailing arm bushing X-tractor"
tools on ebay for $148 total. See

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Schle...4925QQtcZphoto


Some of the fellows posting at www.honda-tech.com are also
passing one of the tools around by mail. See discussion at
http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread/1589298

Couldn't turn up much by way of companies selling the tool,
currently, by googling for it.

I replaced all the suspension bushings in my Civic wagon with a hyper
suspension kit. It was well worth it.

They have the bushings for the trailing arm too that you DONT need an
expensive tool.

Follow the directions, use lots of their lube and you'll have a nice
handling car.


-Speedy