Honda Car Forum

Hi,

Recently I was out of town for 6 month from January to July (I live in
NY by the way so I get some corrosion) and I had my parking break on
the whole time. When I test drove the car after I got back, I noticed
that both my rear brakes were "stuck" to the rotor. So I figured I'd
replace the pads and the rotor and all would be peachy. I just replaced
one of them today and unfortunately, the pads (the piston) would push
out when I step on the break but not retract back in when I let the
break go. When I screwed the piston back in prior to installing the
pads, it did screw back in with resonable amount of resistance. I am
guessing that my caliper is bad. I did some search in this group and
read bits and pieces on cleaing up the caliper including the great
writeup by Tegger. But I am not sure if I can or am willing to go thru
completely breaking down the caliper and putting it back together
again. I read on the posts that rebuilding a caliper myself could
almost cost a smuch as just buying a "new" one.

Q1. Before I go out and spend 100s of dollars on new (well,
remanufactured) calipers, is there anything semi-simple to
check/correct my problem?

Q2. How do the pads retract from the rotor when I let go of the brake
pedal anyway? What is the mechanism?

Q3. And most importantly, does anyone have a writeup on replacing
calipers with pictures (I am more visual than written unfortunately)?
If it includes a howto on bleeding the system (with pictures once
again) that would be much appreciated as well.

If these are subjects that have been covered already and I have't found
it thru my search, I'd appreciate the subject for the thead and/or the
URL.

Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance.

roke wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Recently I was out of town for 6 month from January to July (I live in
> NY by the way so I get some corrosion) and I had my parking break on
> the whole time. When I test drove the car after I got back, I noticed
> that both my rear brakes were "stuck" to the rotor.

that's likely rust between the pad and the disk - nothing to do with the
caliper.

> So I figured I'd
> replace the pads and the rotor and all would be peachy. I just replaced
> one of them today and unfortunately, the pads (the piston) would push
> out when I step on the break but not retract back in when I let the
> break go.

that's the way it's supposed to be. unless you're saying that the pads
squeeze on but won't release.

> When I screwed the piston back in prior to installing the
> pads, it did screw back in with resonable amount of resistance. I am
> guessing that my caliper is bad.

why? they're only supposed to screw in when being serviced - at no
other time.

> I did some search in this group and
> read bits and pieces on cleaing up the caliper including the great
> writeup by Tegger. But I am not sure if I can or am willing to go thru
> completely breaking down the caliper and putting it back together
> again. I read on the posts that rebuilding a caliper myself could
> almost cost a smuch as just buying a "new" one.

so what exactly is the symptom that's causing you concern??? once the
disk is freed from the pads, everything should be fine.

>
> Q1. Before I go out and spend 100s of dollars on new (well,
> remanufactured) calipers, is there anything semi-simple to
> check/correct my problem?

??? what problem???

>
> Q2. How do the pads retract from the rotor when I let go of the brake
> pedal anyway? What is the mechanism?

there is none - they just lightly rest on the disk, provided there's no
rust sticking them in place.

>
> Q3. And most importantly, does anyone have a writeup on replacing
> calipers with pictures (I am more visual than written unfortunately)?
> If it includes a howto on bleeding the system (with pictures once
> again) that would be much appreciated as well.

tegger.com, just like you mentioned above.

>
> If these are subjects that have been covered already and I have't found
> it thru my search, I'd appreciate the subject for the thead and/or the
> URL.
>
> Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance.
>

calipers can and do corrode and wear. unless you have the skills,
replacement is the way to go on resolving any problems with them.

when leaving the car next time, park in gear with the wheels blocked -
don't leave the brAKE on.

>jim beam wrote:

> that's the way it's supposed to be. unless you're saying that the pads
> squeeze on but won't release.
>
That's exactly my problem. The pads got squeezed against the rotor, but
the piston that pushed them does not retract when the brake pedal is
released.


> > When I screwed the piston back in prior to installing the
> > pads, it did screw back in with resonable amount of resistance. I am
> > guessing that my caliper is bad.
>
> why? they're only supposed to screw in when being serviced - at no
> other time.
>
How am I supposed to install the new pads if I don't?


> there is none - they just lightly rest on the disk, provided there's no
> rust sticking them in place.
So you are saying that the brake is "slightly" on all the time?


> when leaving the car next time, park in gear with the wheels blocked -
> don't leave the brAKE on.
Yes, it was pretty stupid of me on hind sight.

One more thing that came to my mind.
When I have the parking brake on, I can not turn the rotor by my hand.
But when I have the parking brake off, I can turn the rotor. It's just
that the pads don't retract fully and rubs against the rotor. So could
it be that my piston is not the problem but whatever mechanism that is
supposed to retract the pads are not working well?

On 8/21/06 1:04 PM, in article
1156183467.653639.93110@74g2000cwt.googlegroups.co m, "roke"
<roki44@hotmail.com> wrote:

> One more thing that came to my mind.
> When I have the parking brake on, I can not turn the rotor by my hand.
> But when I have the parking brake off, I can turn the rotor. It's just
> that the pads don't retract fully and rubs against the rotor. So could
> it be that my piston is not the problem but whatever mechanism that is
> supposed to retract the pads are not working well?
>

The parking brake applies the rear brakes. If you can't turn the rotor when
the parking brake is on, but can when its off, that is exactly the way it is
supposed to work. As many others have said, there is no mechanism to
retract the pads.

"roke" <roki44@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:1156130883.270036.191160@m79g2000cwm.googlegr oups.com:

> Hi,
>
> Recently I was out of town for 6 month from January to July (I live in
> NY by the way so I get some corrosion) and I had my parking break on
> the whole time. When I test drove the car after I got back, I noticed
> that both my rear brakes were "stuck" to the rotor. So I figured I'd
> replace the pads and the rotor and all would be peachy. I just replaced
> one of them today and unfortunately, the pads (the piston) would push
> out when I step on the break but not retract back in when I let the
> break go. When I screwed the piston back in prior to installing the
> pads, it did screw back in with resonable amount of resistance. I am
> guessing that my caliper is bad. I did some search in this group and
> read bits and pieces on cleaing up the caliper including the great
> writeup by Tegger. But I am not sure if I can or am willing to go thru
> completely breaking down the caliper and putting it back together
> again. I read on the posts that rebuilding a caliper myself could
> almost cost a smuch as just buying a "new" one.
>
> Q1. Before I go out and spend 100s of dollars on new (well,
> remanufactured) calipers, is there anything semi-simple to
> check/correct my problem?



Two methods:
1) A quick-and-dirty rebuild, which involves removing and cleaning (or
replacing) the piston, and replacing the dust boot and the hydraulic seal.
Unless you have a fair bit of experience with that sort of thing, I don't
recommend doing it yourself.

2) A simpler approach, involving some Sil-Glyde, a syringe and some brake
cleaner:

Get a syringe at your local pharmacy. All you want is the body, plunger and
the long plastic tip. Make sure they know you DON'T want the "sharp" (the
tip that pierces the skin). Explain why you're wanting it, to help prevent
being refused. Fill the syringe with Sil-Glyde. Actually, Zip-Slip is a
better silicone grease for this purpose as it's less viscous.

Use the spray brake cleaner to wash all the grit and dust off the boot's
lip where it joins the piston.

Stepping on the brake pedal with one caliper off the rotor, eject the
piston about an inch. Each full pedal press is worth about 1/4" of piston
movement. Each press, watch the piston as it moves, and stop once the dust
boot is fully extended. If you're worried about MC seal integrity, place a
block of wood under the pedal to limit movement to what it usually is in
service.

Now pinch the lip of the dust boot away from the piston and inspect the
piston's side. Is it black and carbony looking? Then this silicone idea may
not work very well. Anyway, insert the syringe and inject a bead of
silicone all around the piston as deep as you can go into the boot. Now
screw the piston back in again.

Repeat the eject and screw in several times until you can feel it screw in
more easily. It should be possible to turn the screwdriver easily with one
hand, and both sides should turn in with about the same effort. Add more
silicone if necessary.

This method works very well to resurrect calipers where the piston is not
too badly carboned up.


>
> Q2. How do the pads retract from the rotor when I let go of the brake
> pedal anyway? What is the mechanism?



If the piston is moving freely in its bore, it will retract slightly once
the pedal is released. The same thing happens on the fronts. If it DOES
NOT retract, the piston is sticking.

(FYI, drum brakes operate under a slightly different principle.)



>
> Q3. And most importantly, does anyone have a writeup on replacing
> calipers with pictures (I am more visual than written unfortunately)?
> If it includes a howto on bleeding the system (with pictures once
> again) that would be much appreciated as well.



One more thing I haven't done yet...


>
> If these are subjects that have been covered already and I have't found
> it thru my search, I'd appreciate the subject for the thead and/or the
> URL.
>
> Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance.
>


Hope it helps.


--
TeGGeR®

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

TeGGeR® wrote:

> 2) A simpler approach, involving some Sil-Glyde, a syringe and some brake
> cleaner:


I tried this. I used Sli-Glyde becuase I already had it. I actually did
not step on the brake pedal but instead twisted the piston out with the
wrench until the bot was fully stretched. There were no carbon on the
side at all, actually I could see some grease on the side perhaps from
the previous repair that the dealer tried a while ago. So anyhow, after
repeating the proces a couple of times, I put things back together
again and pulled on the e-brake to test things out. It had no
resistance and went al the way up. The brake pedal was stiff as hell.
This kind of freaked me out. But staying calm, I got my keys and I
turned the ignition to Acc and tried the same thing. This time the
e-rake went up only a couple of clicks like it used to and the brake
pedal felt like it used. So now feeling better again, I went ou to the
rear of the car to turn the axle. Unfortunately, the pads are still
pushed against the rotor and it is hard to turn the axle. Furthermore,
yesterday, I had installed rotor and pads on the other side and this
went great and the axle turned freely without the pads pushing against.
But after the ordeal tonight, even the pads on that side somehow begun
to stay pressed against the rotor. I still think that the idea made
perfect sense, and I feel somewhat optimistic that at least both sides
have equal pressure on the pads albeit, the piston does not seem to
retract fully.

Sorry to make you read all of this, but hopeflly you somewhat get the
picture. What happened, what is wrong and what should I do? Do I need
to go out and get a new caliper?
If I was unclear of anything, please let me know.

Hi, any ideas?

"roke" <roki44@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:1156293614.361967.36960@i3g2000cwc.googlegrou ps.com:

>
> TeGGeR® wrote:
>
>> 2) A simpler approach, involving some Sil-Glyde, a syringe and some
>> brake cleaner:
>
>
> I tried this. I used Sli-Glyde becuase I already had it. I actually
> did not step on the brake pedal but instead twisted the piston out
> with the wrench until the bot was fully stretched. There were no
> carbon on the side at all, actually I could see some grease on the
> side perhaps from the previous repair that the dealer tried a while
> ago. So anyhow, after repeating the proces a couple of times, I put
> things back together again and pulled on the e-brake to test things
> out. It had no resistance and went al the way up. The brake pedal was
> stiff as hell. This kind of freaked me out. But staying calm, I got my
> keys and I turned the ignition to Acc and tried the same thing. This
> time the e-rake went up only a couple of clicks like it used to and
> the brake pedal felt like it used. So now feeling better again, I went
> ou to the rear of the car to turn the axle. Unfortunately, the pads
> are still pushed against the rotor and it is hard to turn the axle.
> Furthermore, yesterday, I had installed rotor and pads on the other
> side and this went great and the axle turned freely without the pads
> pushing against. But after the ordeal tonight, even the pads on that
> side somehow begun to stay pressed against the rotor. I still think
> that the idea made perfect sense, and I feel somewhat optimistic that
> at least both sides have equal pressure on the pads albeit, the piston
> does not seem to retract fully.
>
> Sorry to make you read all of this, but hopeflly you somewhat get the
> picture. What happened, what is wrong and what should I do? Do I need
> to go out and get a new caliper?
> If I was unclear of anything, please let me know.
>



Remove one caliper at a time from its rotor. Measure the piston protrustion
from the caliper body. Pull the parking brake up six clicks, then let it
down again. Is the piston back where it should be, or is it protruding
farther now?

Do the slide pins move in and out freely under light two-finger pressure?
Do the pads fall off the mount bracket by themselves, or with a gentle
touch?

Your mention of the parking brake going up a "couple of clicks" is
disturbing. It should be at *least* six clicks to full engagement. I wonder
if the PB is over-adjusted. You need to back the PB cable adjustment off
until the PB lever touches its stop pin on the caliper on BOTH sides of the
car, step on the pedal a few times to adjust the pistons, THEN adjust the
PB cable so it's full-on at about six clicks.


--
TeGGeR®

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

"roke" <roki44@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:1156378251.480648.111080@m79g2000cwm.googlegr oups.com:

> Hi, any ideas?
>


Ease up, huh? We're all volunteers here with our own lives too. Be happy
with what you get. It's more than you had, otherwise you wouldn't be here.

--
TeGGeR®

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/