Honda Car Forum

Hi Guys!
Need all your help and expert opinion.
My second-hand (or used car) honda civic 97 vtec model has a new
radiator but the engine gets hot when my aircondition is turned on for
quite sometime. I just had the aircondition system "overhauled",
meaning all have been refreshed, and also have a new motor fan. Though
the fan is not original honda, but it works really fine. The fan of the
radiator turns on when the engine is hot. When I drove around 50kms,
the reading at my meter starts to increase from midway to close to the
highest temperature allowed so I have to pull my car in the shoulder
everytime this happens.

There are no leaks I can observed from all hose lines and I observed
that the radiator fan does not turn on too long, only around a minute.
Is this normal?

I do not have problem with overheating if the aircondition system is
not turned on while driving for an hour, this only happens when i turn
the aircondition system on.

Other known fact was that the previous owner of the car (I just
recently learned) have experienced total overheating twice but the
engine was not damaged.

I still don't want to dispose the car and all i want is to fix it.

Looking forward for all your reply and comments. Please email me at
this address: jeffrey.t.dellosa@philips.com

regards,
jeff

Jeffrey D. wrote:
> Hi Guys!
> Need all your help and expert opinion.
> My second-hand (or used car) honda civic 97 vtec model has a new
> radiator but the engine gets hot when my aircondition is turned on for
> quite sometime. I just had the aircondition system "overhauled",
> meaning all have been refreshed, and also have a new motor fan. Though
> the fan is not original honda, but it works really fine. The fan of the
> radiator turns on when the engine is hot. When I drove around 50kms,
> the reading at my meter starts to increase from midway to close to the
> highest temperature allowed so I have to pull my car in the shoulder
> everytime this happens.
>
> There are no leaks I can observed from all hose lines and I observed
> that the radiator fan does not turn on too long, only around a minute.
> Is this normal?
>
> I do not have problem with overheating if the aircondition system is
> not turned on while driving for an hour, this only happens when i turn
> the aircondition system on.
>
> Other known fact was that the previous owner of the car (I just
> recently learned) have experienced total overheating twice but the
> engine was not damaged.
>
> I still don't want to dispose the car and all i want is to fix it.
>
> Looking forward for all your reply and comments. Please email me at
> this address: jeffrey.t.dellosa@philips.com
>
> regards,
> jeff
>
1. check coolant level inside the radiator - looking at the expansion
bottle doesn't work because leaks break the seal that allows it to
operate correctly.

2. replace the thermostat - maybe it's defective - it's 9 years old.

3. test for leaking head gasket. there's a couple of recent threads
here, one titled "Proper Radiator Cap Pressure Rating for 1994 Honda
Accord EX". read them and check your car in the same way as described.

4. report back with your findings.

The fan should also turn on whenever the AC is turned on. Sounds like they
left off a wire somewhere.


On 8/4/06 5:54 AM, in article
1154688884.209757.146340@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups. com, "Jeffrey D."
<jeffrey.t.dellosa@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Guys!
> Need all your help and expert opinion.
> My second-hand (or used car) honda civic 97 vtec model has a new
> radiator but the engine gets hot when my aircondition is turned on for
> quite sometime. I just had the aircondition system "overhauled",
> meaning all have been refreshed, and also have a new motor fan. Though
> the fan is not original honda, but it works really fine. The fan of the
> radiator turns on when the engine is hot. When I drove around 50kms,
> the reading at my meter starts to increase from midway to close to the
> highest temperature allowed so I have to pull my car in the shoulder
> everytime this happens.
>
> There are no leaks I can observed from all hose lines and I observed
> that the radiator fan does not turn on too long, only around a minute.
> Is this normal?
>
> I do not have problem with overheating if the aircondition system is
> not turned on while driving for an hour, this only happens when i turn
> the aircondition system on.
>
> Other known fact was that the previous owner of the car (I just
> recently learned) have experienced total overheating twice but the
> engine was not damaged.
>
> I still don't want to dispose the car and all i want is to fix it.
>
> Looking forward for all your reply and comments. Please email me at
> this address: jeffrey.t.dellosa@philips.com
>
> regards,
> jeff
>

Also, if the fan has been replaced and is not the original, check that it is
blowing in the right direction!!

(i.e. pulling air in to the front of the car)

I think it's most likely the condensor fan not working, especially if
the rad cools fine otherwise. The brushes in the motor wear out after
about 80-100K miles. If you take it apart there will be quite a bit of
carbon dust packed in there.

You can test the fans by turning the key to ON (engine remains off) and
then turn on the AC. The condensor fan should blow and in the right
direction and depending on coolant temperature, the radiator fan may
come on.

Be careful of moving fan blades in the engine compartment.


ib wrote:
> Also, if the fan has been replaced and is not the original, check that it is
> blowing in the right direction!!
>
> (i.e. pulling air in to the front of the car)

i went to the shop last monday and had the car fixed. they noticed that
there is a very high pressure coming out from my radiator even when the
cooling fan is turned on! they believed that the cylinder head gasket
has some leaks. so the car went top overhaul and finally the
temperature gauge never increases near the max limit and the high
pressure is gone. however, they observed that it is too long for the
fan to turned on. and when it turned on, it stops immediately. they
have not fixed this but instead bypassed the fan's circuit. Everytime i
turned on my car, the fan also turns on. But this did not solve still
my problem. what i wanted is for the fan to turn on only when it reach
the midpoint or below the temp gauge.

by the way, the cooling system has no longer a thermostat (since we
don't experience snow here).

some history:
1.0 the car already overheated twice, the second overheating was last
april and went overhaul.
2.0 i have replaced the old radiator with a new one (two row system so
the capacity is bigger)
3.0 recent repair done was the replacement of the cylinder head gasket,
an asbestos and no longer the rubber coated metal gasket. the
technician believe the rubber coated metal gasket will no longer work
so it needs an asbestos type.

some questions that i hope you can help me answer:
1.0 Is the asbestos type will help that the cylinder head gasket will
no longer leak?
2.0 For how long do you think an asbestos type will last?
3.0 Why does a cylinder head gasket leaks? What are the red X or root
cause?
4.0 Is this car hopeless already and the cylinder head gasket will leak
for the rest of the car's life?

hope you can share your thoughts. thank you so much for all the help.

regards,
jeff





jim beam wrote:
> Jeffrey D. wrote:
> > Hi Guys!
> > Need all your help and expert opinion.
> > My second-hand (or used car) honda civic 97 vtec model has a new
> > radiator but the engine gets hot when my aircondition is turned on for
> > quite sometime. I just had the aircondition system "overhauled",
> > meaning all have been refreshed, and also have a new motor fan. Though
> > the fan is not original honda, but it works really fine. The fan of the
> > radiator turns on when the engine is hot. When I drove around 50kms,
> > the reading at my meter starts to increase from midway to close to the
> > highest temperature allowed so I have to pull my car in the shoulder
> > everytime this happens.
> >
> > There are no leaks I can observed from all hose lines and I observed
> > that the radiator fan does not turn on too long, only around a minute.
> > Is this normal?
> >
> > I do not have problem with overheating if the aircondition system is
> > not turned on while driving for an hour, this only happens when i turn
> > the aircondition system on.
> >
> > Other known fact was that the previous owner of the car (I just
> > recently learned) have experienced total overheating twice but the
> > engine was not damaged.
> >
> > I still don't want to dispose the car and all i want is to fix it.
> >
> > Looking forward for all your reply and comments. Please email me at
> > this address: jeffrey.t.dellosa@philips.com
> >
> > regards,
> > jeff
> >
> 1. check coolant level inside the radiator - looking at the expansion
> bottle doesn't work because leaks break the seal that allows it to
> operate correctly.
>
> 2. replace the thermostat - maybe it's defective - it's 9 years old.
>
> 3. test for leaking head gasket. there's a couple of recent threads
> here, one titled "Proper Radiator Cap Pressure Rating for 1994 Honda
> Accord EX". read them and check your car in the same way as described.
>
> 4. report back with your findings.

"Jeffrey D." <jeffrey.t.dellosa@gmail.com> wrote in
news:1155096081.576449.322760@m73g2000cwd.googlegr oups.com:

>
> by the way, the cooling system has no longer a thermostat (since we
> don't experience snow here).



That is not what the thermostat is for. Put it back.

--
TeGGeR®

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Jeffrey D. wrote:
> i went to the shop last monday and had the car fixed. they noticed that
> there is a very high pressure coming out from my radiator even when the
> cooling fan is turned on! they believed that the cylinder head gasket
> has some leaks. so the car went top overhaul and finally the
> temperature gauge never increases near the max limit and the high
> pressure is gone. however, they observed that it is too long for the
> fan to turned on. and when it turned on, it stops immediately. they
> have not fixed this but instead bypassed the fan's circuit. Everytime i
> turned on my car, the fan also turns on.

ugh, ugh. bang rok on hed. bang rok on hed.

> But this did not solve still
> my problem.

really? you're not joking are you?

> what i wanted is for the fan to turn on only when it reach
> the midpoint or below the temp gauge.
>
> by the way, the cooling system has no longer a thermostat (since we
> don't experience snow here).

that is a REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY BAD THING. the block needs
to be kept constant temperature for the fuel injection system to work
properly. that's the function of the thermostat, it's /not/ to remedy
overheating. in addition, the thermostat regulates two different
coolant flow circuits - removal disables this. do not drive this
vehicle until you have a proper factory thermostat re-installed. and
personally, i'd never take it back to whoever did this - they clearly
don't have a clue about what they're doing.

>
> some history:
> 1.0 the car already overheated twice, the second overheating was last
> april and went overhaul.
> 2.0 i have replaced the old radiator with a new one (two row system so
> the capacity is bigger)

waste of money. and the double row's i've seen are often highly
inferior quality. when the system is working correctly, single row
honda rads will keep the engine cool at full throttle up a 30% grade in
july in death valley. the object is to get the system back to working
as per honda spec, not fudge one thing to cover another. again,
whoever's doing this work doesn't know their business.

> 3.0 recent repair done was the replacement of the cylinder head gasket,
> an asbestos and no longer the rubber coated metal gasket. the
> technician believe the rubber coated metal gasket will no longer work
> so it needs an asbestos type.

if it was previously fitted with a rubberized gasket, this car has a
history of gasket leakage. the fiber type is oem. honda sell the
rubberized type to fix "problem" motors for use if a replacement fiber
type fails again. if rubberized came off, rubberized should go back on,
and they need to be used in conjunction with special replacement [not
original] head bolts.

>
> some questions that i hope you can help me answer:
> 1.0 Is the asbestos type will help that the cylinder head gasket will
> no longer leak?

no. other way around. was this head checked for warping or cracks?
there's no point re-using a problem head.

> 2.0 For how long do you think an asbestos type will last?

questions like this only get answered psychic wednesdays. if it hasn't
already started leaking, come back next week.

> 3.0 Why does a cylinder head gasket leaks? What are the red X or root
> cause?

originally, thermal cycling and high load [probably aggravated by an
open deck]. subsequently, inexpert repair and distortion.

> 4.0 Is this car hopeless already and the cylinder head gasket will leak
> for the rest of the car's life?

if it's already had 2 gaskets, with this being the third, i'd toss the
wretched thing and put in a jdm motor for a fraction of the cost of your
ongoing repair bills.

>
> hope you can share your thoughts. thank you so much for all the help.

if you've used radiator sealant in this motor, you won't help cooling
efficiency in any way - it coats everything in a low-conductivity film
of goo, thus injuring heat transfer. BUT DON'T BOTHER WORRYING ABOUT
TRIVIA LIKE THAT IF YOU'RE HAVING THIS VEHICLE REPAIRED BY SOMEONE THAT
DOESN'T KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING. the fan, the radiator, the thermostat,
the gasket??? dude, you're wasting money on stuff you don't need and
not spending it on stuff you do. open the phone book and start calling
around.

>
> regards,
> jeff
>
>
>
>
>
> jim beam wrote:
>> Jeffrey D. wrote:
>>> Hi Guys!
>>> Need all your help and expert opinion.
>>> My second-hand (or used car) honda civic 97 vtec model has a new
>>> radiator but the engine gets hot when my aircondition is turned on for
>>> quite sometime. I just had the aircondition system "overhauled",
>>> meaning all have been refreshed, and also have a new motor fan. Though
>>> the fan is not original honda, but it works really fine. The fan of the
>>> radiator turns on when the engine is hot. When I drove around 50kms,
>>> the reading at my meter starts to increase from midway to close to the
>>> highest temperature allowed so I have to pull my car in the shoulder
>>> everytime this happens.
>>>
>>> There are no leaks I can observed from all hose lines and I observed
>>> that the radiator fan does not turn on too long, only around a minute.
>>> Is this normal?
>>>
>>> I do not have problem with overheating if the aircondition system is
>>> not turned on while driving for an hour, this only happens when i turn
>>> the aircondition system on.
>>>
>>> Other known fact was that the previous owner of the car (I just
>>> recently learned) have experienced total overheating twice but the
>>> engine was not damaged.
>>>
>>> I still don't want to dispose the car and all i want is to fix it.
>>>
>>> Looking forward for all your reply and comments. Please email me at
>>> this address: jeffrey.t.dellosa@philips.com
>>>
>>> regards,
>>> jeff
>>>
>> 1. check coolant level inside the radiator - looking at the expansion
>> bottle doesn't work because leaks break the seal that allows it to
>> operate correctly.
>>
>> 2. replace the thermostat - maybe it's defective - it's 9 years old.
>>
>> 3. test for leaking head gasket. there's a couple of recent threads
>> here, one titled "Proper Radiator Cap Pressure Rating for 1994 Honda
>> Accord EX". read them and check your car in the same way as described.
>>
>> 4. report back with your findings.
>