Honda Car Forum

Well just when I thought I'd did good, I must have messed up. I(a backyard
looser mechanic) replaced my timing belt and water pump on my 91 Civic Hatch
1500cc. After a successful ordeal getting the crankshaft pulley bolt off, I
thought I had made it. Well I must have messed up when I put the T-belt on.
The cam sprocket did move a tiny bit, so I moved it back to the side marks
and the up, straight up. Thought every thing was AOK. Put everything back
and it won't start up.

Went back and took just the top timing belt cover off and when the rotor
cap is pointed to the number one, the cam sprocket shows straight up and
side marks where they are supposed to be. What am I missing?

How can I tell if I'm off a tooth and would just being off one cause it not
to start at all?

thanks in advance

Gary now stranded.......

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 07:57:00 GMT, "Ropert's Aloha"
<removeropertg001@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:

>Well just when I thought I'd did good, I must have messed up. I(a backyard
>looser mechanic) replaced my timing belt and water pump on my 91 Civic Hatch
>1500cc. After a successful ordeal getting the crankshaft pulley bolt off, I
>thought I had made it. Well I must have messed up when I put the T-belt on.
>The cam sprocket did move a tiny bit, so I moved it back to the side marks
>and the up, straight up. Thought every thing was AOK. Put everything back
>and it won't start up.
>
>Went back and took just the top timing belt cover off and when the rotor
>cap is pointed to the number one, the cam sprocket shows straight up and
>side marks where they are supposed to be. What am I missing?
>
>How can I tell if I'm off a tooth and would just being off one cause it not
>to start at all?

Did you do the usual check for fuel and spark?
It's natural to assume the belt is the problem but you may have
knocked off a wire somewhere. Did you change the fuel filter at the
same time by any chance?

i had the same prob with my 1995 civic...its was the coil in the distributor
"John Ings" <nodamned@spam.org> wrote in message
news:t441q09fonsatc21cr057884fbcdgad3p5@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 07:57:00 GMT, "Ropert's Aloha"
> <removeropertg001@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:
>
> >Well just when I thought I'd did good, I must have messed up. I(a
backyard
> >looser mechanic) replaced my timing belt and water pump on my 91 Civic
Hatch
> >1500cc. After a successful ordeal getting the crankshaft pulley bolt off,
I
> >thought I had made it. Well I must have messed up when I put the T-belt
on.
> >The cam sprocket did move a tiny bit, so I moved it back to the side
marks
> >and the up, straight up. Thought every thing was AOK. Put everything back
> >and it won't start up.
> >
> >Went back and took just the top timing belt cover off and when the rotor
> >cap is pointed to the number one, the cam sprocket shows straight up and
> >side marks where they are supposed to be. What am I missing?
> >
> >How can I tell if I'm off a tooth and would just being off one cause it
not
> >to start at all?
>
> Did you do the usual check for fuel and spark?
> It's natural to assume the belt is the problem but you may have
> knocked off a wire somewhere. Did you change the fuel filter at the
> same time by any chance?
>
>

> Did you do the usual check for fuel and spark?

I checked for spark by simply taking out a plug and wire and then cranked. I
saw spark from the plug. I didn't do every plug, but assume that means I
have spark.


Did you change the fuel filter at the
> same time by any chance?

No, didn't change the fuel filter. How would I check for fuel? I really
didn't do anything but take the valve cover off and disconnected the air
cleaner. I looked at all the connections over and over. Maybe I'm missing
something...........

>i had the same prob with my 1995 civic...its was the coil in the
>distributor


But was it after changing the timing belt?? It started fine before changing
the T-belt. I have spark coming out of the plugs, wouldn't that mean the
coil is ok?

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 21:43:47 GMT, "Ropert's Aloha"
<removeropertg001@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:

>No, didn't change the fuel filter. How would I check for fuel?

There's usually a plug at the end of the fuel rail.

The reason I asked is this: If somehow the fuel system has been
drained, the short time the fuel pump runs when you turn the key on is
not enough to refill it. I once changed my fuel filter and then
wondered why the engine wouldn't start. The reason is that it takes
maybe a dozen key-on-key-off cycles without turning the engine over
before the fuel rail is filled and at full operating pressure. The ECU
will not let the pump run for more than a couple of seconds if the
engine is not running. The same situation can occur if you have
leaking injector.

"Ropert's Aloha" <removeropertg001@hawaii.rr.com> wrote in message news:<gTXnd.98200$Kl3.41615@twister.socal.rr.com>. ..
> Well just when I thought I'd did good, I must have messed up. I(a backyard
> looser mechanic) replaced my timing belt and water pump on my 91 Civic Hatch
> 1500cc. After a successful ordeal getting the crankshaft pulley bolt off, I
> thought I had made it. Well I must have messed up when I put the T-belt on.
> The cam sprocket did move a tiny bit, so I moved it back to the side marks
> and the up, straight up. Thought every thing was AOK. Put everything back
> and it won't start up.
>
> Went back and took just the top timing belt cover off and when the rotor
> cap is pointed to the number one, the cam sprocket shows straight up and
> side marks where they are supposed to be. What am I missing?
>
> How can I tell if I'm off a tooth and would just being off one cause it not
> to start at all?
>
> thanks in advance
>
> Gary now stranded.......
Check the PRM-FI relay, located up under the dash, on the left side.
Unless it has been changed you almost certainly have one that is at
best marginal. In the last 3 months I have repaired 13 PGM-FI relays
in 1989 through 1994 Civics an Accords.
Most failed in hot weather, but 2 failed after the car was allow to
"rest" for a week or so in moderate, 50F, weather. Pull the realy, a
major PITA the first time, remove the old solder, and resolder.
Do NOT remove all the solder at the same time else some parts will
fall out. Desolder one spot at a time.
And be ceratin that your spark plugs are in good shape. A friend
had some minor problems, hard start, especialy after a short rest
while the engine and weather wer warm, sometimes rough idle on a
hot start, , some sputtering on heavy acceleration.
I checked his relay and sure enough it was flakey, two joints had
crystalised. I redid his realy and his car still wouldn't start.
I pulled the plugs and they were filthy. Replaced the plugs with
an used set that I cary in my Civic, just in case, and the engine
started right up. The PGM-FI relay was bad because we checked for
fuel presure at the fuel filter. He had about 10K on the plugs.
I advised him to pull and check the plugs every 30 days for a
few months, just to be sure something else isn't wrong.
There is no burst of smoke on a cold start so I doubt if his vavle
seals have failed. The enigne only has 130K on it and he is the
orignal owner and takes good care, changes the oil evey 40000~5000
miles, and changes the air/fule/ filter, pvc favle and spark
plugs onec a year even if there hasn't been enough milage to warrent
it.
Terry

Maybe it is time to check a service manual and make sure you have the cam to
crankshaft timing set correctly and not 180 out.....


"Ropert's Aloha" <removeropertg001@hawaii.rr.com> wrote in message
news:gTXnd.98200$Kl3.41615@twister.socal.rr.com...
> Well just when I thought I'd did good, I must have messed up. I(a backyard
> looser mechanic) replaced my timing belt and water pump on my 91 Civic
> Hatch
> 1500cc. After a successful ordeal getting the crankshaft pulley bolt off,
> I
> thought I had made it. Well I must have messed up when I put the T-belt
> on.
> The cam sprocket did move a tiny bit, so I moved it back to the side marks
> and the up, straight up. Thought every thing was AOK. Put everything back
> and it won't start up.
>
> Went back and took just the top timing belt cover off and when the rotor
> cap is pointed to the number one, the cam sprocket shows straight up and
> side marks where they are supposed to be. What am I missing?
>
> How can I tell if I'm off a tooth and would just being off one cause it
> not
> to start at all?
>
> thanks in advance
>
> Gary now stranded.......
>
>

Good point, but not likely on an engine where the distributor runs off
the end of the cam shaft.

Woody wrote:
>
> Maybe it is time to check a service manual and make sure you have the cam to
> crankshaft timing set correctly and not 180 out.....
>
> "Ropert's Aloha" <removeropertg001@hawaii.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:gTXnd.98200$Kl3.41615@twister.socal.rr.com...
> > Well just when I thought I'd did good, I must have messed up. I(a backyard
> > looser mechanic) replaced my timing belt and water pump on my 91 Civic
> > Hatch
> > 1500cc. After a successful ordeal getting the crankshaft pulley bolt off,
> > I
> > thought I had made it. Well I must have messed up when I put the T-belt
> > on.
> > The cam sprocket did move a tiny bit, so I moved it back to the side marks
> > and the up, straight up. Thought every thing was AOK. Put everything back
> > and it won't start up.
> >
> > Went back and took just the top timing belt cover off and when the rotor
> > cap is pointed to the number one, the cam sprocket shows straight up and
> > side marks where they are supposed to be. What am I missing?
> >
> > How can I tell if I'm off a tooth and would just being off one cause it
> > not
> > to start at all?
> >
> > thanks in advance
> >
> > Gary now stranded.......
> >
> >

Randolph wrote:
> Good point, but not likely on an engine where the distributor runs off
> the end of the cam shaft.

valve timing, not ignition. he could be trying to ignite an exhaust
cycle, not compression.

>
> Woody wrote:
>
>>Maybe it is time to check a service manual and make sure you have the cam to
>>crankshaft timing set correctly and not 180 out.....
>>
>>"Ropert's Aloha" <removeropertg001@hawaii.rr.com> wrote in message
>>news:gTXnd.98200$Kl3.41615@twister.socal.rr.com. ..
>>
>>>Well just when I thought I'd did good, I must have messed up. I(a backyard
>>>looser mechanic) replaced my timing belt and water pump on my 91 Civic
>>>Hatch
>>>1500cc. After a successful ordeal getting the crankshaft pulley bolt off,
>>>I
>>>thought I had made it. Well I must have messed up when I put the T-belt
>>>on.
>>>The cam sprocket did move a tiny bit, so I moved it back to the side marks
>>>and the up, straight up. Thought every thing was AOK. Put everything back
>>>and it won't start up.
>>>
>>>Went back and took just the top timing belt cover off and when the rotor
>>>cap is pointed to the number one, the cam sprocket shows straight up and
>>>side marks where they are supposed to be. What am I missing?
>>>
>>>How can I tell if I'm off a tooth and would just being off one cause it
>>>not
>>>to start at all?
>>>
>>>thanks in advance
>>>
>>>Gary now stranded.......
>>>
>>>