Honda Car Forum

"mike" <mikein562athotmail@hotmail.com> wrote
> "Caroline" <caroline10027remove@earthlink.net> wrote in message
snip for conciseness
> > Could you give the approx. number of miles on each car with the orange dex
> stuff
> > in the engine cooling system?
>
> one motorcycle, kawasaki, about 10 years or so. 98 civic, 3 years/20k miles,
> various watercooled honda scooters.
> >
> > Also, how often you drained and refilled?
>
> bike/scooters? yearly. car? 3 years so far and its about due.

Thanks, Mike.

Aside: My 91 Civic's Maintenance Schedule says change the coolant every 30k
miles/2 years, whichever comes first.

I called Honda Canada customer service, I have a 91 Accord with 265K, pumps
were only changed with the timing belt, rad went at 200K. I change the
coolant every year and always use regular Prestone. I did the same with my
84 Prelude which had 267K when I sold it, the rad and water pump were still
original!! What more can I say?

"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in message
news:67lk70tkqhkj1ockmj74u8ckk6k2tt425s@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 18:41:17 -0400, "Grahame" <grahame.joyce@sympatico.ca>
> wrote:
>
> >Why don't you call Honda yourself, I did and they recommended the regular
> >Prestone or Honda's brand only. I change mine every year and have never
had
> >any problems using the cheaper Prestone.
>
> What "Honda" did you call, corporate Customer Service or a dealer? I
> seriously doubt that anyone representing Honda would recommend the regular
> Prestone. IME it *will* destroy the water pump bearing.
>
> Rgds, George Macdonald
>
> "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who,
me??

mike wrote:

>>I will admit that I have heard of a handful of people who've had no
>>problem whatsoever. Luck of the draw, I guess. On the other hand,
>>some years ago on the Internet, there were photomicrographs of the
>>actual seals from Honda pumps, showing seal abrasion.
>
>
> which is why i always use the dexcool compatible stuff- orange coolant in
> the silver jug. no silicates, no phosphates, no problems on any of the 3
> japanese vehicles ive used it on.

Again - phosphates are not a problem as long as you don't mix in hard
water. Honda Type 2 coolant is only available pre-mixed with deionized
water anyways. AFAIK, Honda coolant does use phosphates.

Havoline's extended-life coolant was the only Dex-Cool licensed product
for years, save ACDelco coolant (which was way overpriced, hard to find,
and probably the same coolant made in the same factories). Now Prestone
has a Dex-Cool license for their extended-life coolant in the silver
bottle.

cc0034030 wrote:

> I would never use anything but Honda antifreeze in a Honda auto. My 87
> Accord's water pump failed shortly after I did a change to a brand other
> than Honda. However I have used the Havoline Dex-Cool in my 99 Miata for 4
> years without a flush. The fluid looks like the day I put it in.
>
> Do you think that the remaining half-gallon in the antifreeze bottle is
> still good after 4 years?

The claim a shelf-life of at least 8 years.

<http://www.havoline.com/products/la/antifreeze_01_tech.html>

"The primary limiting factor in the shelf life of a coolant is silicate
instability. Since silicate will eventually polymerize to silicate gel,
all traditional coolants have a shelf life of about 18 months.Havoline
Extended Life Anti-Freeze/Coolant DEX-COOL is silicate-free and
therefore can be stored for at least 8 years without a problem, provided
the integrity of the container is maintained."

BTW - in addition to the Havoline, ACDelco, and Prestone Dex-Cool
coolants, there's a Chevron one out now. Probably just the Havoline
version relabelled (i.e. Chevron-Texaco merger).

On Tue, 13 Apr 2004 10:52:42 -0400, "Grahame" <grahame.joyce@sympatico.ca>
wrote:

>I called Honda Canada customer service, I have a 91 Accord with 265K, pumps
>were only changed with the timing belt, rad went at 200K. I change the
>coolant every year and always use regular Prestone. I did the same with my
>84 Prelude which had 267K when I sold it, the rad and water pump were still
>original!! What more can I say?

Honda Canada appears not to know what is in their very own owner manuals -
what is it about silicate/borate free that is unclear? IMO changing
coolant every year is an unnecessary burden on both recycling and
production resources.

My experience with Prestone regular coolant is contrary to yours... with a
'90 Civic the water pump was bound up tight at ~20K miles after using
Prestone antifreeze mixed with distilled water. Whatever your experience,
it is *not* universally applicable to Hondas - IOW if you propose it as
advice to others here you're going to get contradicted. Have you ever
changed a timing belt & water pump yourself to actually see/feel the
results?

>"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in message
>news:67lk70tkqhkj1ockmj74u8ckk6k2tt425s@4ax.com.. .
>> On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 18:41:17 -0400, "Grahame" <grahame.joyce@sympatico.ca>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Why don't you call Honda yourself, I did and they recommended the regular
>> >Prestone or Honda's brand only. I change mine every year and have never
>had
>> >any problems using the cheaper Prestone.
>>
>> What "Honda" did you call, corporate Customer Service or a dealer? I
>> seriously doubt that anyone representing Honda would recommend the regular
>> Prestone. IME it *will* destroy the water pump bearing.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

Hey, I'm not trying to contradict anyone, this is MY experience, the water
must be extremely pure up here or something. But it seems if you own a GM
product Dexcool causes their pumps to fail.

"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in message
news:1eqp70la3fkf5qndejemt8nbuokh04ethr@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 13 Apr 2004 10:52:42 -0400, "Grahame" <grahame.joyce@sympatico.ca>
> wrote:
>
> >I called Honda Canada customer service, I have a 91 Accord with 265K,
pumps
> >were only changed with the timing belt, rad went at 200K. I change the
> >coolant every year and always use regular Prestone. I did the same with
my
> >84 Prelude which had 267K when I sold it, the rad and water pump were
still
> >original!! What more can I say?
>
> Honda Canada appears not to know what is in their very own owner manuals -
> what is it about silicate/borate free that is unclear? IMO changing
> coolant every year is an unnecessary burden on both recycling and
> production resources.
>
> My experience with Prestone regular coolant is contrary to yours... with a
> '90 Civic the water pump was bound up tight at ~20K miles after using
> Prestone antifreeze mixed with distilled water. Whatever your experience,
> it is *not* universally applicable to Hondas - IOW if you propose it as
> advice to others here you're going to get contradicted. Have you ever
> changed a timing belt & water pump yourself to actually see/feel the
> results?
>
> >"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in
message
> >news:67lk70tkqhkj1ockmj74u8ckk6k2tt425s@4ax.com.. .
> >> On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 18:41:17 -0400, "Grahame"
<grahame.joyce@sympatico.ca>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Why don't you call Honda yourself, I did and they recommended the
regular
> >> >Prestone or Honda's brand only. I change mine every year and have
never
> >had
> >> >any problems using the cheaper Prestone.
> >>
> >> What "Honda" did you call, corporate Customer Service or a dealer? I
> >> seriously doubt that anyone representing Honda would recommend the
regular
> >> Prestone. IME it *will* destroy the water pump bearing.
>
> Rgds, George Macdonald
>
> "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who,
me??

On Wed, 14 Apr 2004 20:07:35 -0400, "Grahame" <grahame.joyce@sympatico.ca>
wrote:

>Hey, I'm not trying to contradict anyone, this is MY experience, the water
>must be extremely pure up here or something. But it seems if you own a GM
>product Dexcool causes their pumps to fail.

It sounded like you were offering advice... advice which goes against
Honda's written advice in owner manuals, service manuals and TSBs and the
experience of others here, including me. Are you now saying you also use
tap water?

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

Is there now a problem with tap water?
"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in message
news:hf0u70t5nrr07s2nj714b67kohl4ckme71@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 14 Apr 2004 20:07:35 -0400, "Grahame" <grahame.joyce@sympatico.ca>
> wrote:
>
> >Hey, I'm not trying to contradict anyone, this is MY experience, the
water
> >must be extremely pure up here or something. But it seems if you own a GM
> >product Dexcool causes their pumps to fail.
>
> It sounded like you were offering advice... advice which goes against
> Honda's written advice in owner manuals, service manuals and TSBs and the
> experience of others here, including me. Are you now saying you also use
> tap water?
>
> Rgds, George Macdonald
>
> "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who,
me??

> Is there now a problem with tap water?

in a lot of places, yes. too hard, too many minerals in it. not good for the
cooling system, since it gets on stuff and clogs passages.

On Fri, 16 Apr 2004 15:51:45 -0400, "Grahame" <grahame.joyce@sympatico.ca>
wrote:

>Is there now a problem with tap water?

Of course. Apart from the possibility of solids coming out of solution and
clogging passages, most tap water is at least a mild electrolyte and some
are quite efficient electrolytes. Putting such stuff in an engine where
you have different metals........<shrug>

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??