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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 15 Feb 2004, 11:06 pm
Mike S.
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Default Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L

I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year now. Had
dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that works is
high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86 but it
even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.

Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this car for
four years 2 miles to/from her work.

Thanks for any suggestions!

Mike S.


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 16 Feb 2004, 12:15 am
Randolph
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Default Re: Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L

Did you have any work done on the car prior to this problem? Timing belt
change, ignition timing adjustment etc.? I am not asking because I can
provide any particular insight, but I am curious as my '94 Civic with
the same D16Z6 engine as yours has been doing the same thing since about
March of last year, particularly in warmer weather.

"Mike S." wrote:
>
> I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year now. Had
> dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that works is
> high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86 but it
> even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.
>
> Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this car for
> four years 2 miles to/from her work.
>
> Thanks for any suggestions!
>
> Mike S.

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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 16 Feb 2004, 12:33 am
'Curly Q. Links'
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L



Mike S. wrote:
-> I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year now. Had
> dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that works is
> high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86 but it
> even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.
>
> Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this car for
> four years 2 miles to/from her work.
>
> Thanks for any suggestions!
>
> Mike S.
>


===============

What's the mileage, are you at high altitude, when was the timing belt
last changed, what plugs did the dealer put in, does it always start
well, have you checked your dash lights to be sure that some of the
imprortant ones aren't burnt out? Does it ping when cold or only when it
indicates normal temperature? Is your idle stable when cold and hot?
When was the distributor cap changed last? Does it ever backfire thru
the intake or exhaust? When did you last adjust the valves?

'Curly'

============

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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 16 Feb 2004, 01:35 am
Pailyn
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L

I have the exact same problem on my 91 Si. I'm the second owner. The first
owner drove it to and from work for about 8 years..less than 5 miles each
way.

It's very likely that carbon built up from the short drives, that's what I
suspect on my car. I have to use premium on mine as well.. 89 is just not
good enough. I don't mine paying the extra 10-20 cents though. I still get
36 mpg combined city/hwy, and about 39 hwy.


"Mike S." <jmsjunkmail@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:IkXXb.318901$I06.3236955@attbi_s01...
> I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year now.

Had
> dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that works

is
> high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86 but it
> even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.
>
> Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this car for
> four years 2 miles to/from her work.
>
> Thanks for any suggestions!
>
> Mike S.
>
>



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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 16 Feb 2004, 10:35 am
Mike S.
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L

Randolph - the short answer is no. It has been pinging since I met my wife
in 1999 (she bought the car new in 1994) although not nearly as bad as it
does now. We had the timing belt changed about two years ago around 90,000
miles.

It is worse during hot days and very dry air but that is simply the physics
of when a piston engine is more likely to detonate. I drive the car
typically shifting around 3000-3500 rpm and it will ping throughout the
whole range.


"Randolph" <trash@junkmail.com> wrote in message
news:40305250.F5FD6A39@junkmail.com...
> Did you have any work done on the car prior to this problem? Timing belt
> change, ignition timing adjustment etc.? I am not asking because I can
> provide any particular insight, but I am curious as my '94 Civic with
> the same D16Z6 engine as yours has been doing the same thing since about
> March of last year, particularly in warmer weather.
>
> "Mike S." wrote:
> >
> > I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year now.

Had
> > dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that

works is
> > high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86 but

it
> > even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.
> >
> > Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this car

for
> > four years 2 miles to/from her work.
> >
> > Thanks for any suggestions!
> >
> > Mike S.



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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 16 Feb 2004, 10:48 am
Mike S.
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L

Great questions -
current mileage - around 118,000
elevation - 200 feet amsl (Richmond VA)
timing belt - 90,291
standard plugs per the owner's manual - I questioned them on whether hotter
or colder plugs would help
starts very quickly unless it sits for several days but then only a couple
seconds more of cranking
all dash lights appear to work when ignition first turned to on
does not ping when cold, only when at full temperature
idle is fine hot and cold
distributor cap and rotor at 90,291
never backfires, ever
valves adjusted at 90,291

Several dealers and other mechanics have tried fuel injector cleaner and
throttle body cleaned twice. I really believe it is excessive deposits in
the cylinders as my wife is a short shifter (I try to run it harder when I
drive it) and for the first five years she only commuted two miles each way
to her work. The last dealer did not have a borescope and could not look
inside the cylinders.

"'Curly Q. Links'" <motsco__@interbaun.com> wrote in message
news:4030562B.5020801@interbaun.com...
>
>
> Mike S. wrote:
> -> I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year now.

Had
> > dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that

works is
> > high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86 but

it
> > even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.
> >
> > Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this car

for
> > four years 2 miles to/from her work.
> >
> > Thanks for any suggestions!
> >
> > Mike S.
> >

>
> ===============
>
> What's the mileage, are you at high altitude, when was the timing belt
> last changed, what plugs did the dealer put in, does it always start
> well, have you checked your dash lights to be sure that some of the
> imprortant ones aren't burnt out? Does it ping when cold or only when it
> indicates normal temperature? Is your idle stable when cold and hot?
> When was the distributor cap changed last? Does it ever backfire thru
> the intake or exhaust? When did you last adjust the valves?
>
> 'Curly'
>
> ============
>



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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 16 Feb 2004, 10:53 am
Mike S.
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L

Pailyn - I wish I could say the same about the fuel costs. While we average
about 35 MPG the extra 10 (89 octane) or 20 (92 octane) cents per gallon
amounts to $40-$80 a year for us at 14,000 miles/year. That money could be
better spent on lunch and beer! It just bugs me that the car should run
fine on as low as 86 octane (per the manual) and it does not.


"Pailyn" <fluffydaddym3@yahoooo.com> wrote in message
news:ixZXb.194373$U%5.1006503@attbi_s03...
> I have the exact same problem on my 91 Si. I'm the second owner. The

first
> owner drove it to and from work for about 8 years..less than 5 miles each
> way.
>
> It's very likely that carbon built up from the short drives, that's what I
> suspect on my car. I have to use premium on mine as well.. 89 is just not
> good enough. I don't mine paying the extra 10-20 cents though. I still

get
> 36 mpg combined city/hwy, and about 39 hwy.
>
>
> "Mike S." <jmsjunkmail@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:IkXXb.318901$I06.3236955@attbi_s01...
> > I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year now.

> Had
> > dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that

works
> is
> > high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86 but

it
> > even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.
> >
> > Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this car

for
> > four years 2 miles to/from her work.
> >
> > Thanks for any suggestions!
> >
> > Mike S.
> >
> >

>
>



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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 16 Feb 2004, 01:13 pm
Pailyn
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L

If you find something that works or cure your problem please let me know.
You can email me directly. I have used a bottle of that GM ..$30/bottle
fuel injection cleaner before in an effort to clean it out with no luck. If
could get it down to not ping with regular unleaded I would be happier as
well...


"Mike S." <jmsjunkmail@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:YH5Yb.197043$U%5.1026770@attbi_s03...
> Pailyn - I wish I could say the same about the fuel costs. While we

average
> about 35 MPG the extra 10 (89 octane) or 20 (92 octane) cents per gallon
> amounts to $40-$80 a year for us at 14,000 miles/year. That money could

be
> better spent on lunch and beer! It just bugs me that the car should run
> fine on as low as 86 octane (per the manual) and it does not.
>
>
> "Pailyn" <fluffydaddym3@yahoooo.com> wrote in message
> news:ixZXb.194373$U%5.1006503@attbi_s03...
> > I have the exact same problem on my 91 Si. I'm the second owner. The

> first
> > owner drove it to and from work for about 8 years..less than 5 miles

each
> > way.
> >
> > It's very likely that carbon built up from the short drives, that's what

I
> > suspect on my car. I have to use premium on mine as well.. 89 is just

not
> > good enough. I don't mine paying the extra 10-20 cents though. I still

> get
> > 36 mpg combined city/hwy, and about 39 hwy.
> >
> >
> > "Mike S." <jmsjunkmail@comcast.net> wrote in message
> > news:IkXXb.318901$I06.3236955@attbi_s01...
> > > I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year now.

> > Had
> > > dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that

> works
> > is
> > > high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86

but
> it
> > > even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.
> > >
> > > Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this car

> for
> > > four years 2 miles to/from her work.
> > >
> > > Thanks for any suggestions!
> > >
> > > Mike S.
> > >
> > >

> >
> >

>
>



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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 16 Feb 2004, 10:11 pm
George Macdonald
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L

On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 04:06:00 GMT, "Mike S." <jmsjunkmail@comcast.net>
wrote:

>I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year now. Had
>dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that works is
>high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86 but it
>even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.
>
>Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this car for
>four years 2 miles to/from her work.


It could be carbon build-up and the non-tear-down "solutions" are sometimes
efective: e.g. a mechanic's decoke... IOW an extended hard blast down a
freeway. Maybe this, with one of the fuel additives which claim to clean
combustion chambers could help.

Another thing to consider is oxygenated fuel. If the oxygenate is ethanol
and there is some water present in the fuel tank, you can get a significant
reduction in effective octane of the gasoline. Ethanol, at 10%
concentration in gasoline, has an effective octane blending number of 111
so it contributes greatly to the gasoline's octane. Any separated water
will pull the ethanol out of the gasoline and therefore reduce its octane
number. In that case, try a bottle of isopropyl alcohol gas line
"antifreeze". Do *not* use rubbing alcohol.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 16 Feb 2004, 10:34 pm
Mike S.
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Pinging/Detonation-94 Civic EX 1.6L

Pailyn - I will certainly contact you if I find the "cure". I have tried
Chevron's Techron and Amsoil's fuel injector cleaner also but to no avail.

"Pailyn" <fluffydaddym3@yahoooo.com> wrote in message
news:bL7Yb.323022$I06.3310720@attbi_s01...
> If you find something that works or cure your problem please let me know.
> You can email me directly. I have used a bottle of that GM ..$30/bottle
> fuel injection cleaner before in an effort to clean it out with no luck.

If
> could get it down to not ping with regular unleaded I would be happier as
> well...
>
>
> "Mike S." <jmsjunkmail@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:YH5Yb.197043$U%5.1026770@attbi_s03...
> > Pailyn - I wish I could say the same about the fuel costs. While we

> average
> > about 35 MPG the extra 10 (89 octane) or 20 (92 octane) cents per gallon
> > amounts to $40-$80 a year for us at 14,000 miles/year. That money could

> be
> > better spent on lunch and beer! It just bugs me that the car should run
> > fine on as low as 86 octane (per the manual) and it does not.
> >
> >
> > "Pailyn" <fluffydaddym3@yahoooo.com> wrote in message
> > news:ixZXb.194373$U%5.1006503@attbi_s03...
> > > I have the exact same problem on my 91 Si. I'm the second owner. The

> > first
> > > owner drove it to and from work for about 8 years..less than 5 miles

> each
> > > way.
> > >
> > > It's very likely that carbon built up from the short drives, that's

what
> I
> > > suspect on my car. I have to use premium on mine as well.. 89 is just

> not
> > > good enough. I don't mine paying the extra 10-20 cents though. I

still
> > get
> > > 36 mpg combined city/hwy, and about 39 hwy.
> > >
> > >
> > > "Mike S." <jmsjunkmail@comcast.net> wrote in message
> > > news:IkXXb.318901$I06.3236955@attbi_s01...
> > > > I have been fighting excessive pinging/detonation for over a year

now.
> > > Had
> > > > dealer clean throttle body and change plugs but the only thing that

> > works
> > > is
> > > > high octane fuel. According to owner's manual minimum octane is 86

> but
> > it
> > > > even pings with midgrade 89 octane with low humidity.
> > > >
> > > > Could it be carbon buildup in the cylinders? - my wife drove this

car
> > for
> > > > four years 2 miles to/from her work.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for any suggestions!
> > > >
> > > > Mike S.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >

> >
> >

>
>



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