Honda Car Forum

My 1995 Odyssey seems to be leaking between the block and the engine
oil cooler and I plan to remove the oil cooler to replace the o-ring.

Can anyone tell me the size of the hollow bolt that holds on the oil
cooler on? My biggest socket is 27 mm and it's not big enough.

Also, is there enough flex in the coolant hoses to move the cooler to
get to the o-ring without having to drain the cooling fluid?

I want to get this done quickly since I have no garage, it's below
zero most nights and there is little shade from trees in Vermont
winter. I was hoping to wait until spring, but I'm losing 2 quarts a
week. Thanks in advance!

Ed

In article <9b6d7d43.0401241909.2bd8e85c@posting.google.com >,
appl31416@yahoo.com (Ed) wrote:

> My 1995 Odyssey seems to be leaking between the block and the engine
> oil cooler and I plan to remove the oil cooler to replace the o-ring.
>
> Can anyone tell me the size of the hollow bolt that holds on the oil
> cooler on? My biggest socket is 27 mm and it's not big enough.
>
> Also, is there enough flex in the coolant hoses to move the cooler to
> get to the o-ring without having to drain the cooling fluid?
>
> I want to get this done quickly since I have no garage, it's below
> zero most nights and there is little shade from trees in Vermont
> winter. I was hoping to wait until spring, but I'm losing 2 quarts a
> week. Thanks in advance!
>
> Ed

That sounds like a messy task best left to a small service shop. Some
repairs are much easier when you can raise the car six feet, get in
there with a giant wrench, and let all the fluids spill into a large
pan. Buy the replacement O-ring in advance so they don't try any tricks
with sillicone.

Kevin McMurtrie <mcmurtri@dslextreme.com> wrote in message news:<mcmurtri-BD99A2.01145025012004@corp-radius.supernews.com>...
>
> That sounds like a messy task best left to a small service shop. Some
> repairs are much easier when you can raise the car six feet, get in
> there with a giant wrench, and let all the fluids spill into a large
> pan. Buy the replacement O-ring in advance so they don't try any tricks
> with sillicone.

Kevin, Thanks for the input. I agree with you about independent shops,
but this job is only a half step harder than changing the oil filter.
The bolt is only torqued to 56 ft-lbs, so it shouldn't need a giant wrench.

I'm hoping that I don't have to drain the coolant, but if I do, it's as good
a time as any to change that too.

Ed

Hi folks,

I got a 98 Accord LX 4-door with 83K miles. I bought the car last summer
with 77K on it. I recently have been noticing manual tranny problems..
indeed for some time, even before it got cold here in Indiana.

The problem is not tranny slipping, since there has never been a case with
RPMs going up and the speed remaining the same at the same time.

I may describe the problem as a "bony gearbox", somewhat hard shifting
or gears somewhat grinding.. This is particularly experienced when
upshifting from 1 to 2 *the most* and also from 2 to 3.. I have noticed
the problem MOST when upshifting, for it definitely does NOT have any
problem when you DOWNSHIFT from 3 to 2. Downshifting from 2 to 1 has been a
problem as well even though at speeds of about 10 MPH.

Do you think i need new blocker rings? or new gear cones? or what do you
think / suggest ?!!

Thanks a bunch in advance.. cheers, --Ersin

On Fri, 30 Jan 2004 08:45:35 -0500, "M. Ersin Deger" <degerm@purdue.edu>
wrote:

>Hi folks,
>
>I got a 98 Accord LX 4-door with 83K miles. I bought the car last summer
>with 77K on it. I recently have been noticing manual tranny problems..
>indeed for some time, even before it got cold here in Indiana.
>
>The problem is not tranny slipping, since there has never been a case with
>RPMs going up and the speed remaining the same at the same time.
>
>I may describe the problem as a "bony gearbox", somewhat hard shifting
>or gears somewhat grinding.. This is particularly experienced when
>upshifting from 1 to 2 *the most* and also from 2 to 3.. I have noticed
>the problem MOST when upshifting, for it definitely does NOT have any
>problem when you DOWNSHIFT from 3 to 2. Downshifting from 2 to 1 has been a
>problem as well even though at speeds of about 10 MPH.

Quit trying to shift from 2 to 1 at 10mph - the box is not made for it and
frankly I see no need for it. The synchro on 1 is really only there to
provide smooth shifts into 1 when the car is stationary or almost. If you
really insist on 2-1 while still moving, learn to double clutch.

Does it shift 1-2 and 2-3 smoother if you pause briefly in neutral between
the two? How is the clutch and its fluid? You might want to change the
clutch fluid and make sure it's bled properly of any air - Honda has no
scheduled change for this but IMO it *is* important.

>Do you think i need new blocker rings? or new gear cones? or what do you
>think / suggest ?!!

It could be that the synchro rings or cones are a bit worn. Personally
I've never had such problems on high mileage Hondas and if they are worn it
would indicate possible abuse by the previous owner. It's also possible
that the previous owner put the wrong oil in the gearbox - some people
think that since Honda used to recommend engine oil for the purpose, it's
better to use a synthetic engine oil. This is most definitely not the case
and the first thing I'd try in your situation is to replace the oil with
Honda MTF.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

On Fri, 30 Jan 2004, George Macdonald wrote:

> On Fri, 30 Jan 2004 08:45:35 -0500, "M. Ersin Deger" <degerm@purdue.edu>
> wrote:
>
> >Hi folks,
> >
> >I got a 98 Accord LX 4-door with 83K miles. I bought the car last summer
> >with 77K on it. I recently have been noticing manual tranny problems..
> >indeed for some time, even before it got cold here in Indiana.
> >
> >The problem is not tranny slipping, since there has never been a case with
> >RPMs going up and the speed remaining the same at the same time.
> >
> >I may describe the problem as a "bony gearbox", somewhat hard shifting
> >or gears somewhat grinding.. This is particularly experienced when
> >upshifting from 1 to 2 *the most* and also from 2 to 3.. I have noticed
> >the problem MOST when upshifting, for it definitely does NOT have any
> >problem when you DOWNSHIFT from 3 to 2. Downshifting from 2 to 1 has been a
> >problem as well even though at speeds of about 10 MPH.
>
> Quit trying to shift from 2 to 1 at 10mph - the box is not made for it and
> frankly I see no need for it. The synchro on 1 is really only there to
> provide smooth shifts into 1 when the car is stationary or almost. If you
> really insist on 2-1 while still moving, learn to double clutch.
>
> Does it shift 1-2 and 2-3 smoother if you pause briefly in neutral between
> the two? How is the clutch and its fluid? You might want to change the
> clutch fluid and make sure it's bled properly of any air - Honda has no
> scheduled change for this but IMO it *is* important.

This is exactly what happens.. It shifts smoother if you hold the clutch a
while and then engage in the upper gear.

Would you think then MTF and clutch fluid replacement is the best thing to
do? Looks like you hit the bull's eye! you knew it..

Thank you, --ersin

On Fri, 30 Jan 2004 18:29:44 -0500, "M. Ersin Deger" <degerm@purdue.edu>
wrote:

>On Fri, 30 Jan 2004, George Macdonald wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 30 Jan 2004 08:45:35 -0500, "M. Ersin Deger" <degerm@purdue.edu>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Hi folks,
>> >
>> >I got a 98 Accord LX 4-door with 83K miles. I bought the car last summer
>> >with 77K on it. I recently have been noticing manual tranny problems..
>> >indeed for some time, even before it got cold here in Indiana.
>> >
>> >The problem is not tranny slipping, since there has never been a case with
>> >RPMs going up and the speed remaining the same at the same time.
>> >
>> >I may describe the problem as a "bony gearbox", somewhat hard shifting
>> >or gears somewhat grinding.. This is particularly experienced when
>> >upshifting from 1 to 2 *the most* and also from 2 to 3.. I have noticed
>> >the problem MOST when upshifting, for it definitely does NOT have any
>> >problem when you DOWNSHIFT from 3 to 2. Downshifting from 2 to 1 has been a
>> >problem as well even though at speeds of about 10 MPH.
>>
>> Quit trying to shift from 2 to 1 at 10mph - the box is not made for it and
>> frankly I see no need for it. The synchro on 1 is really only there to
>> provide smooth shifts into 1 when the car is stationary or almost. If you
>> really insist on 2-1 while still moving, learn to double clutch.
>>
>> Does it shift 1-2 and 2-3 smoother if you pause briefly in neutral between
>> the two? How is the clutch and its fluid? You might want to change the
>> clutch fluid and make sure it's bled properly of any air - Honda has no
>> scheduled change for this but IMO it *is* important.
>
>This is exactly what happens.. It shifts smoother if you hold the clutch a
>while and then engage in the upper gear.

In most cars I've driven, 1-2 is often a hit or miss affair - sometimes
it's smooth and other times I feel a slight graunch... magnified when cold
of course. The 2K Accord we have does not feel as "positive" as the
Integra, I assume because the Civic/Integra is more direct with a shaft
which goes straight from the gear lever into the gearbox; the Accord's
cable system is better than some other similar designs but when I drive my
wife's Accord I do get the feeling it doesn't like to be rushed. It's not
bad but it's just not as "slick" as the Integra.

>Would you think then MTF and clutch fluid replacement is the best thing to
>do? Looks like you hit the bull's eye! you knew it..

The MTF change schedule is 90Kmiles(30K severe) so it's near time anyway
but DIY or make a point to insist on the genuine Honda MTF - it makes a big
difference and even dealers have been known to just fill from the bulk
engine oil tank. Take a look at the clutch fluid in the reservoir - it's
probably dark and slimey and if not changed you'll be replacing the master
and slave cylinders soon.

I'd also check the cable linkage under the hood - it's easy to see and get
at. Just brush off any dirt and put a little grease on the cable end
bearings - I smear just a little moly-grease and then wash it in with a
penetrating grease spray, like SuperLube.

BTW, if you see Tom Morin, say Hi to him from me.:-)

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

Well, on my 91 Accord, I used a 30mm socket. If you don't already
have one, get a 6-point socket so there's less chance of messing up
the bolt.

There's enough flex in the lines on the Accord to not have to remove
them. Oil up the new o-ring and slide the assembly in nice and easy;
you can't really see how well it goes in, but if your fingers aren't
frozen solid you can feel if anything binds and pulls the gasket off
the mark (and you'll end up with a leak again...).

The dealer quoted $150 for the job. And it only took me about a half
hour (and a $5 gasket) and I'm really slow.

Joe,

Thanks for the information. Unfortunately, my Odyssey took a turn for
the worse last Friday. After driving less than a mile, the engine
stopped and would not restart. There were no bad noises and it would
crank but not catch. My wife had to walk home (a separate story in itself).

I tried what I could on the roadside and then had it towed to the garage.
It turns out that the camshaft had snapped at one of the bearing journals
so there was no spark and the valve timing was off. I can't say this is due
to the leaky oil cooler seal, but it certainly didn't help.

The mechanic's recommendation is to put in a 'good' used engine since there
was a fair bit of oil sludge buildup in the old engine. I can't complain
too much since the old engine went 180,000 miles.

I believe your info for the Accord would be the same for the Odyssey since the
engine I'm getting is coming from an Accord.

Regards, Ed

M. Ersin Deger wrote:
> The problem is not tranny slipping, since there has never been a case with
> RPMs going up and the speed remaining the same at the same time.
>
> I may describe the problem as a "bony gearbox", somewhat hard shifting
> or gears somewhat grinding.. This is particularly experienced when
> upshifting from 1 to 2 *the most* and also from 2 to 3.. I have noticed
> the problem MOST when upshifting, for it definitely does NOT have any
> problem when you DOWNSHIFT from 3 to 2. Downshifting from 2 to 1 has been a
> problem as well even though at speeds of about 10 MPH.
>
> Do you think i need new blocker rings? or new gear cones? or what do you
> think / suggest ?!!

Personally I think your trans is fine, but you actually have clutch
problems. It sounds like your clutch is not disengaging properly. It
could be a mechanical defect or maybe the release mechanism need
attention. I had one where the springs of the clutch disk came in
contact with the flywheel bolts and created a problem like you describe.

-SP