Honda Car Forum

I've got a 1988 Honda Civic that a few days started making a strange noise.
It's a loud rattle..very mechanical sounding....coming from the engine. It is
definitely not the heat shield or something like that. Being somewhat handy,
I first tried to diagnose this. The engine seems to run normally but we
haven't driven any distance since the noise started. Long story short.....it
is dripping antifreeze from around the main shaft (where the belts are). This
is almost certainly a water pump failure, yes? The noise is getting
substantial now and I'm wondering if, even the car can be driven, should I tow
it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt? I fear for
the TB en route if I drive.

Replacing the water pump is also essentially replacing the TB too. Is this a
job I might undertake? I have many tools and have done various car repairs
like alternator, brakes, valves, etc. This job seems much bigger but possibly
do-able. Thoughts?
Thanks
SS

On 31 Dec 2003 19:20:24 GMT, steadisteve@aol.comstopspam (SteadiSteve)
wrote:

>I've got a 1988 Honda Civic that a few days started making a strange noise.
>It's a loud rattle..very mechanical sounding....coming from the engine. It is
>definitely not the heat shield or something like that. Being somewhat handy,
>I first tried to diagnose this. The engine seems to run normally but we
>haven't driven any distance since the noise started. Long story short.....it
>is dripping antifreeze from around the main shaft (where the belts are). This
>is almost certainly a water pump failure, yes? The noise is getting
>substantial now and I'm wondering if, even the car can be driven,

NO!

> should I tow
>it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt?

YES!

> I fear for
>the TB en route if I drive.

GOOD!

>Replacing the water pump is also essentially replacing the TB too. Is this a
>job I might undertake? I have many tools and have done various car repairs
>like alternator, brakes, valves, etc. This job seems much bigger but possibly
>do-able. Thoughts?

Hard to say. It's not for beginners and I wouldn't do it myself. Some
say the hardest part is breaking loose the pulley nut. Get a service
manual and judge for yourself. Whoever does it, make sure they
install genuine Honda TB, pump and antifreeze.


A few questions for you:

How many years/miles since the last TB and/or pump?

How often do you change coolant?

What kind of coolant do you use?



>Thanks
>SS

On 31 Dec 2003 19:20:24 GMT, steadisteve@aol.comstopspam (SteadiSteve) wrote:

|I've got a 1988 Honda Civic that a few days started making a strange noise.
|It's a loud rattle..very mechanical sounding....coming from the engine. It is
|definitely not the heat shield or something like that. Being somewhat handy,
|I first tried to diagnose this. The engine seems to run normally but we
|haven't driven any distance since the noise started. Long story short.....it
|is dripping antifreeze from around the main shaft (where the belts are). This
|is almost certainly a water pump failure, yes? The noise is getting
|substantial now and I'm wondering if, even the car can be driven, should I tow
|it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt? I fear for
|the TB en route if I drive.
|
|Replacing the water pump is also essentially replacing the TB too. Is this a
|job I might undertake? I have many tools and have done various car repairs
|like alternator, brakes, valves, etc. This job seems much bigger but possibly
|do-able. Thoughts?
|Thanks

Correct, do not drive it. Although I don't think it's an intereference engine,
so the worst would be you are stranded somewhere.
Changing pump & TB is not rocket science, but budget a weekend for it to be on
the safe side. Hardest part for me was getting the crank bolt out.

Rex in Fort Worth

On Wed, 31 Dec 2003 19:49:57 GMT, NOSPAMrex@REMOVEtxol.net (Rex B)
wrote:

>On 31 Dec 2003 19:20:24 GMT, steadisteve@aol.comstopspam (SteadiSteve) wrote:
>
>|I've got a 1988 Honda Civic that a few days started making a strange noise.
>|It's a loud rattle..very mechanical sounding....coming from the engine. It is
>|definitely not the heat shield or something like that. Being somewhat handy,
>|I first tried to diagnose this. The engine seems to run normally but we
>|haven't driven any distance since the noise started. Long story short.....it
>|is dripping antifreeze from around the main shaft (where the belts are). This
>|is almost certainly a water pump failure, yes? The noise is getting
>|substantial now and I'm wondering if, even the car can be driven, should I tow
>|it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt? I fear for
>|the TB en route if I drive.
>|
>|Replacing the water pump is also essentially replacing the TB too. Is this a
>|job I might undertake? I have many tools and have done various car repairs
>|like alternator, brakes, valves, etc. This job seems much bigger but possibly
>|do-able. Thoughts?
>|Thanks
>
>Correct, do not drive it. Although I don't think it's an intereference engine,
>so the worst would be you are stranded somewhere.
> Changing pump & TB is not rocket science, but budget a weekend for it to be on
>the safe side. Hardest part for me was getting the crank bolt out.

I think the important stuff has already been said..

To answer the question of is is this a job you want to take on, take a
look at http://timingbelt.soben.com

I documented the one I did on my Integra. The '88 Civic might be a
bit easier because I think the engine bay is a little less dense and
it may only be SOHC, but the procedure is similar.

Good luck!

__________________
Note: To reply, replace the word 'spam' embedded in return address with 'mail'.
N38.6 W121.4

You may want to look into joining AAIA (Automotive Aftermarket Industry
Association). Check them out at http://www.aftermarket.org

SteadiSteve wrote:
>
> I've got a 1988 Honda Civic that a few days started making a strange noise.
> It's a loud rattle..very mechanical sounding....coming from the engine. It is
> definitely not the heat shield or something like that. Being somewhat handy,
> I first tried to diagnose this. The engine seems to run normally but we
> haven't driven any distance since the noise started. Long story short.....it
> is dripping antifreeze from around the main shaft (where the belts are). This
> is almost certainly a water pump failure, yes? The noise is getting
> substantial now and I'm wondering if, even the car can be driven, should I tow
> it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt? I fear for
> the TB en route if I drive.
>
> Replacing the water pump is also essentially replacing the TB too. Is this a
> job I might undertake? I have many tools and have done various car repairs
> like alternator, brakes, valves, etc. This job seems much bigger but possibly
> do-able. Thoughts?
> Thanks
> SS

Sorry. Responded to the wrong thread.

Randolph wrote:
>
> You may want to look into joining AAIA (Automotive Aftermarket Industry
> Association). Check them out at http://www.aftermarket.org
>
> SteadiSteve wrote:
> >
> > I've got a 1988 Honda Civic that a few days started making a strange noise.
> > It's a loud rattle..very mechanical sounding....coming from the engine. It is
> > definitely not the heat shield or something like that. Being somewhat handy,
> > I first tried to diagnose this. The engine seems to run normally but we
> > haven't driven any distance since the noise started. Long story short.....it
> > is dripping antifreeze from around the main shaft (where the belts are). This
> > is almost certainly a water pump failure, yes? The noise is getting
> > substantial now and I'm wondering if, even the car can be driven, should I tow
> > it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt? I fear for
> > the TB en route if I drive.
> >
> > Replacing the water pump is also essentially replacing the TB too. Is this a
> > job I might undertake? I have many tools and have done various car repairs
> > like alternator, brakes, valves, etc. This job seems much bigger but possibly
> > do-able. Thoughts?
> > Thanks
> > SS

I had to weld a 1" piece of stock to 2 cut off bolts to keep the crankshaft
wheel from turning while I removed the 17mm nut from the crankshaft pulley
wheel. Beyond that it is easy. You will want to put some marks on the old
belt and the cam wheel before you disturb anything ..it will save you time
on the new installation since you have all the marks as well as how many
"ridges" (on the timing belt) are between the pulley and cam shaft etc. Good
luck. wolf
"SteadiSteve" <steadisteve@aol.comstopspam> wrote in message
news:20031231142024.15398.00002162@mb-m04.aol.com...
> I've got a 1988 Honda Civic that a few days started making a strange
noise.
> It's a loud rattle..very mechanical sounding....coming from the engine.
It is
> definitely not the heat shield or something like that. Being somewhat
handy,
> I first tried to diagnose this. The engine seems to run normally but we
> haven't driven any distance since the noise started. Long story
short.....it
> is dripping antifreeze from around the main shaft (where the belts are).
This
> is almost certainly a water pump failure, yes? The noise is getting
> substantial now and I'm wondering if, even the car can be driven, should I
tow
> it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt? I fear
for
> the TB en route if I drive.
>
> Replacing the water pump is also essentially replacing the TB too. Is
this a
> job I might undertake? I have many tools and have done various car
repairs
> like alternator, brakes, valves, etc. This job seems much bigger but
possibly
> do-able. Thoughts?
> Thanks
> SS

SteadiSteve wrote:
>
> I've got a 1988 Honda Civic that a few days started making a strange noise.
> It's a loud rattle..very mechanical sounding....coming from the engine. It is
> definitely not the heat shield or something like that. Being somewhat handy,
> I first tried to diagnose this. The engine seems to run normally but we
> haven't driven any distance since the noise started. Long story short.....it
> is dripping antifreeze from around the main shaft (where the belts are). This
> is almost certainly a water pump failure, yes? The noise is getting
> substantial now and I'm wondering if, even the car can be driven, should I tow
> it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt? I fear for
> the TB en route if I drive.
>
> Replacing the water pump is also essentially replacing the TB too. Is this a
> job I might undertake? I have many tools and have done various car repairs
> like alternator, brakes, valves, etc. This job seems much bigger but possibly
> do-able. Thoughts?
> Thanks
> SS
you can go to autzone and buy a water pump for about $30.00 and a timing
belt for about $50 and do it yourself with a haynes manual, cost about
$15.00... get the book first and study it and then decide if you can do
it yourself.. or go to shop and pay about $400 for the job....

> should I tow
>it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt?

>YES!

Thanks to everyone for all the replies. I am not going to start the car at all
at this point. I called the dealership and they also strongly advised that I
tow it in. They said that the TB/water pump repair is routine and quoted $350
but the service tech was concerned about the noise that I described. Seemed
to think there could be more serious trouble. I guess we'll see.
The engine does run so the belt isn't snapped yet. But it is definitely some
kind of rapping/rattling mechanical noise.
>
>A few questions for you:
>
>How many years/miles since the last TB and/or pump?

I'm not positive. We bought the car used as a stop-gap vehicle at the time.
We expected to use it for a year. That was four years ago. I specifically
asked about the timing belt and the seller said that it had been replaced.
Although he couldn't produce the paperwork at the time, I do believe him to
this day. If I had to guess I would estimate about 5 years ago and 25000 miles
since the last TB change.

>
>How often do you change coolant?
>
The radiator crapped-out about 2 years ago so it all got replaced. Haven't
changed it since and was starting to think about dealing with it.


>What kind of coolant do you use?
>
>
I'm not sure what they put in at the time. My wife dealt with it
completely...I was crushed at work. Anything that I've added is stuff I just
picked up at the auto parts store.....you know Prestone and the like.

I haven't decided whether to undertake the job myself. I believe I can do it
after reading through a number of resources but I'm beginning to get busy with
life again.

Thanks to who replied. I'll post any updates here.

On 31 Dec 2003 19:20:24 GMT, steadisteve@aol.comstopspam (SteadiSteve)
wrote:

>I've got a 1988 Honda Civic that a few days started making a strange noise.
>It's a loud rattle..very mechanical sounding....coming from the engine. It is
>definitely not the heat shield or something like that. Being somewhat handy,
>I first tried to diagnose this. The engine seems to run normally but we
>haven't driven any distance since the noise started. Long story short.....it
>is dripping antifreeze from around the main shaft (where the belts are). This
>is almost certainly a water pump failure, yes? The noise is getting
>substantial now and I'm wondering if, even the car can be driven, should I tow
>it to the dealer for the replacement of the pump and timing belt? I fear for
>the TB en route if I drive.

I've never heard a rattling sound from a failing water pump - could be that
a corroded impeller blade(s) is completely detached from the shaft. I
wouldn't drive it at all.

>Replacing the water pump is also essentially replacing the TB too. Is this a
>job I might undertake? I have many tools and have done various car repairs
>like alternator, brakes, valves, etc. This job seems much bigger but possibly
>do-able. Thoughts?

The job is not that difficult but as mentioned getting the crank pulley
bolt off is quite difficult. An '88 Civic will not have the 50mmm hex
"socket" for a pulley holder tool so the options are a 1) a *big* impact
wrench 2) a screwdriver jammed in the ring gear; or 3) an improvised tool
made from heavy angle iron and a couple of bolts through holes drilled in
it, which engage with the holes in the pulley. A strap wrench on the
pulley would likely damage the rubber damper built into the pulley.

I'd advise making sure you can get the pulley bolt off before doing any
further disassembly.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??