Honda Car Forum

Hello Folks
I drive a Honda civic 1998 LX - Few days back my check engine light
turned on

I took it to the dealer. He supposedly did some checks and said that
the code maps to a top dead center (tdc) sensor problem (probably
related to the distributor). He was not sure about this and said that
he didnt have sufficient data to suggest doing anything. He reset the
light and I had my car back.He charged 90+ bucks for the entire
process which took less than an hour
Next day I see the light go on again. This is kind of frustrating
,given that I had paid fair amount of money for diagnostics and had
spend ample time commuting to the dealer in the midst of a busy day

Question
1. What are my options? Better Business Bureau? This is not my first
experience (mis-diagnosis that is) with this guy.
2. Under these circumstances can i ask for a refund for this and take
it to another mechanic? Am i "eligible" for a refund?
3. Is it OK to the dealer to charge me yet again saying that initially
he was unable to detect the problem based on the code?
4.As far as I am concerned the mechanical problem in as much is an
orthogonal issue - but any inputs will be useful regrding the problem
per se

Background:

I have been going to the same honda dealer for all my car service
needs;In fact I had serviced last month - 60K. I have been doing my
service @ regular intervals-as per the manual.

Thanks much - in advance
John

In article <56b13b6e.0309071814.4c8da4a6@posting.google.com >,
jp_1872@yahoo.com (John Pifer) wrote:

> 1. What are my options? Better Business Bureau? This is not my first
> experience (mis-diagnosis that is) with this guy.

He burned you once already, and you VOLUNTARILY go back? And now you
want to scream BBB?



> 2. Under these circumstances can i ask for a refund for this and take
> it to another mechanic? Am i "eligible" for a refund?

You are eligible for anything you can negotiate with the servicing
dealer. If you can negotiate that he drives your kids to school until
they graduate, more power to you. There aren't any "rules" to anything
like this. What, do you think that there's a book somewhere that spells
out some bunch of rules that everyone has to abide by?

If you can't come to a settlement, you *can* sue him in small claims
court. I'm not saying you'd win; I'm simply saying that's the route
we've come up with to settle differences like these.



> 3. Is it OK to the dealer to charge me yet again saying that initially
> he was unable to detect the problem based on the code?

Shit happens. Yes, it's OK. Of course, I have a servicing dealer that
wouldn't have charged me in the first place--or, if he did, wouldn't
keep charging me if I bring the car back in a few more times, every day
for a week.




> I have been going to the same honda dealer for all my car service
> needs;In fact I had serviced last month - 60K. I have been doing my
> service @ regular intervals-as per the manual.

You're ready to scream BBB for this, yet you have a RELATIONSHIP with
this dealership??? Jesus Christ, grow a pair and walk in and ask to
speak with the service manager. You're a regular customer; he'll be
happy to fix it and apply the $90 you've already spent to the final
repair.

Good God. What a ball-less individual you are.

John Pifer wrote:>>

> Hello Folks
> I drive a Honda civic 1998 LX - Few days back my check engine light
> turned on

> I took it to the dealer. He supposedly did some checks and said that
> the code maps to a top dead center (tdc) sensor problem (probably
> related to the distributor). He was not sure about this and said that
> he didnt have sufficient data to suggest doing anything. He reset the
> light and I had my car back.He charged 90+ bucks for the entire
> process which took less than an hour
> Next day I see the light go on again. This is kind of frustrating
> ,given that I had paid fair amount of money for diagnostics and had
> spend ample time commuting to the dealer in the midst of a busy day

I bought a used van. Took it to the shop and their computer told me the
reason my battery went dead is because I needed a new carburator.



> Question
> 1. What are my options? Better Business Bureau? This is not my first
> experience (mis-diagnosis that is) with this guy.

What do you expect the BBS to do? All they do is keep track of complaints.

> 2. Under these circumstances can i ask for a refund for this and take
> it to another mechanic? Am i "eligible" for a refund?

You can ask, but you won't get it. Were you not told the price up front? $90
is a bit high. $60 is the going average hourly charge. Take it to an
independent place like Midas and let them check it.

> 3. Is it OK to the dealer to charge me yet again saying that initially
> he was unable to detect the problem based on the code?

Yes. You're paying for his time.

> 4.As far as I am concerned the mechanical problem in as much is an
> orthogonal issue - but any inputs will be useful regrding the problem
> per se

Disconnect the light and forget it.

> Background:

> I have been going to the same honda dealer for all my car service
> needs;In fact I had serviced last month - 60K. I have been doing my
> service @ regular intervals-as per the manual.

You can always try out other dealers.

> Thanks much - in advance
> John

On 7 Sep 2003 19:14:26 -0700, jp_1872@yahoo.com (John Pifer) wrote:

>Hello Folks
>I drive a Honda civic 1998 LX - Few days back my check engine light
>turned on
>
>I took it to the dealer. He supposedly did some checks and said that
>the code maps to a top dead center (tdc) sensor problem (probably
>related to the distributor). He was not sure about this and said that
>he didnt have sufficient data to suggest doing anything. He reset the
>light and I had my car back.He charged 90+ bucks for the entire
>process which took less than an hour

At that point you should have asked for the code.

>Next day I see the light go on again. This is kind of frustrating
>,given that I had paid fair amount of money for diagnostics and had
>spend ample time commuting to the dealer in the midst of a busy day
>
>Question
>1. What are my options? Better Business Bureau? This is not my first
>experience (mis-diagnosis that is) with this guy.

BBB is on their side IME.

>2. Under these circumstances can i ask for a refund for this and take
>it to another mechanic? Am i "eligible" for a refund?

I think you should probably find someone else. Refund - no.

>3. Is it OK to the dealer to charge me yet again saying that initially
>he was unable to detect the problem based on the code?

That's for negotiation between you and them.

>4.As far as I am concerned the mechanical problem in as much is an
>orthogonal issue - but any inputs will be useful regrding the problem
>per se

Get the code and post it here... as well as any possible glitches you've
noticed in behavior.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

George Macdonald wrote:


>
> BBB is on their side IME.
>

Oh how right you are!

Franz Bestuchev <fbestuchev@n05p4m.userealsugar.com> wrote in message news:<bjhtcc$rg9$5@peabody.colorado.edu>...
> George Macdonald wrote:
>
>
> >
> > BBB is on their side IME.
> >
>
> Oh how right you are!

Thx,George - u a dealer ?
I learned it the hard way - Dealer says he cannot waive the
troubleshooting costs and he needs 400 bucks to replace a weak
distributor coil
Ripoff i say

John Pifer wrote:

> Franz Bestuchev <fbestuchev@n05p4m.userealsugar.com> wrote in message news:<bjhtcc$rg9$5@peabody.colorado.edu>...
>
>>George Macdonald wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>BBB is on their side IME.
>>>
>>
>>Oh how right you are!
>
>
> Thx,George - u a dealer ?
> I learned it the hard way - Dealer says he cannot waive the
> troubleshooting costs and he needs 400 bucks to replace a weak
> distributor coil
> Ripoff i say

Last I replaced one, a coil was two wires and two bolts. Screw them. Buy
the parts online and then go to the dealership and show them your handy
work.

On 8 Sep 2003 21:16:39 -0700, jp_1872@yahoo.com (John Pifer) wrote:

>Franz Bestuchev <fbestuchev@n05p4m.userealsugar.com> wrote in message news:<bjhtcc$rg9$5@peabody.colorado.edu>...
>> George Macdonald wrote:
>>
>>
>> >
>> > BBB is on their side IME.
>> >
>>
>> Oh how right you are!
>
>Thx,George - u a dealer ?

Nope - just someone who got bent over a few times before I went DIY.

>I learned it the hard way - Dealer says he cannot waive the
>troubleshooting costs and he needs 400 bucks to replace a weak
>distributor coil

I'd want to be a bit more sure about the distributor coil and yes, it *is*
a rip-off. Check out the price of the coil on-line and figure it's a
half-hour job for a competent DIYer - stretch it to an hour for the
persnickety DIYer. If DIY is out of the question, try to find an good
independent shop who specializes in Hondas/imports.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

Get yourself an OBII scanner ($50) or a real Service literature ($70)
both online and see who's in charge. A human is just a human. But a
human with tools has the leverage and do whatever he/she want. This is
why the Neanderthals dissapeared.

Just buy a new distributor kit below and keep the old as backup. A
caveman can install this unit without foulup, for the exception of no
banging.

$143 housing (this house TDC sensor.
156 igniter
70 coil
13 rotor.

If you cut/past carefully you could see your parts. 1998 Civic 4dr
auto.

http://www.hondaautomotiveparts.com/...TEC-WEASTEC%29

> > > BBB is on their side IME.
> > >
> >
> > Oh how right you are!
>
> Thx,George - u a dealer ?
> I learned it the hard way - Dealer says he cannot waive the
> troubleshooting costs and he needs 400 bucks to replace a weak
> distributor coil
> Ripoff i say