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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 28 Apr 2010, 05:44 pm
robb
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Default [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?

Well thanks to all who replied back in February.

Problem:
Dull clunking noise coming from the front end of '91 Acura
Integra LS - 5 spd... ***but*** only at a very particular driving
circumstance of coasting to the bottom of one particular steep
hill in 1st gear, then making a very sharp right onto an upward
hill and shifting into second after making the turn. Somwhere in
the turn and shifting the clunk would occur but not every time.

Sounded like some kind of suspension or mount etc problem.

Well the car stranded the driver immediately following the final
clunk which was a particularly louder and bigger clunkier clunk
(as i was told).

Car runs fine, the engine cranks easily , no obvious noises,
clutch feels the same, transmission shifts or feels like it is
shifting and when you look under the car everything seems to
look normal (that is nothing is hanging or drooping or fallen
out )....

The only diagnostic of any note is that when you press clutch and
shift into higher 4th/5th gears and release the clutch you hear a
buzzy/whiny noise that increases it's buzzy/pitch with the
revving of the engine but at lower gears the noise is almost
in-perceptible.


So anyone care to have a guess at the problem ? (answer below)
robb
..
..
spoiler space
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..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
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broken inboard joint on right driveshaft

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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 02 May 2010, 05:10 pm
Tegger
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Default Re: [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?

"robb" <some@where.on.net> wrote in news:X_KdnQxbY-
yxJ0XWnZ2dnUVZ_ridnZ2d@earthlink.com:

> Well thanks to all who replied back in February.
>
> Problem:
> Dull clunking noise coming from the front end of '91 Acura
> Integra LS - 5 spd... ***but*** only at a very particular driving
> circumstance of coasting to the bottom of one particular steep
> hill in 1st gear, then making a very sharp right onto an upward
> hill and shifting into second after making the turn. Somwhere in
> the turn and shifting the clunk would occur but not every time.
>
> .
> broken inboard joint on right driveshaft
>



Thanks for the update. That's one I've never heard of before.

I'll bet those were aftermarket driveshafts.


--
Tegger
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 03 May 2010, 01:10 pm
robb
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Default Re: [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?


"Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
news:Xns9D6CB8BB973D1tegger@208.90.168.18...
> "robb" <some@where.on.net> wrote in news:X_KdnQxbY-
> yxJ0XWnZ2dnUVZ_ridnZ2d@earthlink.com:
>
> > Well thanks to all who replied back in February.
> >
> > Problem:
> > Dull clunking noise coming from the front end of '91 Acura
> > Integra LS - 5 spd... ***but*** only at a very particular

driving
> > circumstance of coasting to the bottom of one particular

steep
> > hill in 1st gear, then making a very sharp right onto an

upward
> > hill and shifting into second after making the turn. Somwhere

in
> > the turn and shifting the clunk would occur but not every

time.
> >
> > .
> > broken inboard joint on right driveshaft
> >

>
>
> Thanks for the update. That's one I've never heard of before.
>
> I'll bet those were aftermarket driveshafts.
> --
> Tegger


I think you would win that bet.

I have a recollection of replacing the driveshaft about 10 years
ago. I would **more than** likely have purchased cheaper units
from the local (non-oem) parts store

robb




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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 03 May 2010, 01:45 pm
Jim Yanik
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Default Re: [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?

"robb" <some@where.on.net> wrote in
news:rIidnaLNXdvpjELWnZ2dnUVZ_gidnZ2d@earthlink.co m:

>
> "Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
> news:Xns9D6CB8BB973D1tegger@208.90.168.18...
>> "robb" <some@where.on.net> wrote in news:X_KdnQxbY-
>> yxJ0XWnZ2dnUVZ_ridnZ2d@earthlink.com:
>>
>> > Well thanks to all who replied back in February.
>> >
>> > Problem:
>> > Dull clunking noise coming from the front end of '91 Acura
>> > Integra LS - 5 spd... ***but*** only at a very particular

> driving
>> > circumstance of coasting to the bottom of one particular

> steep
>> > hill in 1st gear, then making a very sharp right onto an

> upward
>> > hill and shifting into second after making the turn. Somwhere

> in
>> > the turn and shifting the clunk would occur but not every

> time.
>> >
>> > .
>> > broken inboard joint on right driveshaft
>> >

>>
>>
>> Thanks for the update. That's one I've never heard of before.
>>
>> I'll bet those were aftermarket driveshafts.
>> --
>> Tegger

>
> I think you would win that bet.
>
> I have a recollection of replacing the driveshaft about 10 years
> ago. I would **more than** likely have purchased cheaper units
> from the local (non-oem) parts store
>
> robb
>
>
>
>
>


so,what you said is that the aftermarket shaft lasted about as long as the
original OEM Honda shaft.... :-)

Now,I'd want to know why the driveshafts are failing.... rough roads or
driving style? [no offense intended...]

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 03 May 2010, 08:24 pm
Tegger
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?

Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in
news:Xns9D6D961EAC318jyaniklocalnetcom@216.168.3.4 4:


>>

>
> so,what you said is that the aftermarket shaft lasted about as long as
> the original OEM Honda shaft.... :-)




OEM inner CV joints would never break.

And I'll bet the OEM outer joints failed because the boots were allowed to
split. Replace the boots in a timely manner, and OEM outer CV joints last
almost forever.



--
Tegger
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 04 May 2010, 05:59 am
robb
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?


"Jim Yanik" <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in message
news:Xns9D6D961EAC318jyaniklocalnetcom@216.168.3.4 4...
> "robb" <some@where.on.net> wrote in
> news:rIidnaLNXdvpjELWnZ2dnUVZ_gidnZ2d@earthlink.co m:
>
> >
> > "Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
> > news:Xns9D6CB8BB973D1tegger@208.90.168.18...
> >> "robb" <some@where.on.net> wrote in news:X_KdnQxbY-
> >> yxJ0XWnZ2dnUVZ_ridnZ2d@earthlink.com:
> >>
> >> > Well thanks to all who replied back in February.
> >> >
> >> > Problem:
> >> > Dull clunking noise coming from the front end of '91 Acura
> >> > Integra LS - 5 spd...

[trim]
>
> so,what you said is that the aftermarket shaft lasted about as

long as the
> original OEM Honda shaft.... :-)
>
> Now,I'd want to know why the driveshafts are failing.... rough

roads or
> driving style? [no offense intended...]
>
> --
> Jim Yanik
>


That is a good try Jim, but this might change your mind.

It is a low mileage car about 147k miles. the first 10 years saw
the brunt of that at about 100+ K.
I think the problem then was, as tegger guessed, the boots had
split and that CV failed.

No offense taken here as for why they are failing.
It is a low mileage car but they are hard miles with lots of
stop'n go, lots of turns, hills, bad pavement and including lots
of time in creeping rush hour traffic.

I am not the main driver so i can not comment on the driving
style.

robb


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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 04 May 2010, 07:09 am
Tegger
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?

"robb" <some@where.on.net> wrote in
newsr6dndRhh7p4YELWnZ2dnUVZ_uSdnZ2d@earthlink.co m:


>
> No offense taken here as for why they are failing.
> It is a low mileage car but they are hard miles with lots of
> stop'n go, lots of turns, hills, bad pavement and including lots
> of time in creeping rush hour traffic.
>
> I am not the main driver so i can not comment on the driving
> style.
>



Driving style isn't important.

OEM joints do not break; aftermarket ones do.


--
Tegger
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 06 May 2010, 01:20 pm
Dave D
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Default Re: [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?


"Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
news:Xns9D6E52D92ECB1tegger@208.90.168.18...
> "robb" <some@where.on.net> wrote in
> newsr6dndRhh7p4YELWnZ2dnUVZ_uSdnZ2d@earthlink.co m:
>
>
>>
>> No offense taken here as for why they are failing.
>> It is a low mileage car but they are hard miles with lots of
>> stop'n go, lots of turns, hills, bad pavement and including lots
>> of time in creeping rush hour traffic.
>>
>> I am not the main driver so i can not comment on the driving
>> style.
>>

>
>
> Driving style isn't important.
>
> OEM joints do not break; aftermarket ones do.
>
>
> --
> Tegger


I agree and disagree with you Tegger. I have replaced many OEM Honda axles
with failed joints. However, failure was caused by split boots that went
undetected until the ominous "clicking" from the front end was heard. All
were outer joints as has been noted. Any joint OEM or aftermarket will fail
in that situation. I can imagine only one reason for an inner joint to fail,
though. Poor quality! Either the metal was not good or the QC at the
manufacturer was seriously lacking. Oh, just a mo'... If the axle had been
pulled to replace the outer boot/joint and the inner boot was disloged
during R&R that could cause a failure, I believe? Not a common occurrence.

DaveD


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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 06 May 2010, 01:50 pm
Tegger
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?

"Dave D" <dtdodson@acsalaska.net> wrote in
news:4be3086c$1@news.acsalaska.net:

>
> "Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
> news:Xns9D6E52D92ECB1tegger@208.90.168.18...


>>
>> OEM joints do not break; aftermarket ones do.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Tegger

>
> I agree and disagree with you Tegger. I have replaced many OEM Honda
> axles with failed joints. However, failure was caused by split boots
> that went undetected




That's not a joint failure, that's a boot failure.

Boots take several years from the first appearance of cracks to when the
boots let go entirely. There is no excuse for allowing boots to split
completely.



> until the ominous "clicking" from the front end
> was heard. All were outer joints as has been noted. Any joint OEM or
> aftermarket will fail in that situation.




That's why the boots are there in the first place. You're supposed to keep
an eye on them and replace before they split. You have at least three years
to catch that.

Would you wait until your oil light came on before checking your oil?



> I can imagine only one reason
> for an inner joint to fail, though. Poor quality! Either the metal was
> not good or the QC at the manufacturer was seriously lacking. Oh, just
> a mo'... If the axle had been pulled to replace the outer boot/joint
> and the inner boot was disloged during R&R that could cause a failure,
> I believe?




Not likely. Boot replacement requires removal of the inner joint before you
can slide the boot off the outer one. So generally you replace both inner
and outer boots at once.

And in any case, actuall /breakage/ of either joint is unheard of with OEM,
but is a possibility with aftermarket.


--
Tegger
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 06 May 2010, 02:44 pm
jim beam
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: [update] mystery clunk from acura integra '91 front end ?

On 05/06/2010 11:50 AM, Tegger wrote:
> "Dave D"<dtdodson@acsalaska.net> wrote in
> news:4be3086c$1@news.acsalaska.net:
>
>>
>> "Tegger"<invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
>> news:Xns9D6E52D92ECB1tegger@208.90.168.18...

>
>>>
>>> OEM joints do not break; aftermarket ones do.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Tegger

>>
>> I agree and disagree with you Tegger. I have replaced many OEM Honda
>> axles with failed joints. However, failure was caused by split boots
>> that went undetected

>
>
>
> That's not a joint failure, that's a boot failure.
>
> Boots take several years from the first appearance of cracks to when the
> boots let go entirely. There is no excuse for allowing boots to split
> completely.
>
>
>
>> until the ominous "clicking" from the front end
>> was heard. All were outer joints as has been noted. Any joint OEM or
>> aftermarket will fail in that situation.

>
>
>
> That's why the boots are there in the first place. You're supposed to keep
> an eye on them and replace before they split. You have at least three years
> to catch that.
>
> Would you wait until your oil light came on before checking your oil?
>
>
>
>> I can imagine only one reason
>> for an inner joint to fail, though. Poor quality! Either the metal was
>> not good or the QC at the manufacturer was seriously lacking. Oh, just
>> a mo'... If the axle had been pulled to replace the outer boot/joint
>> and the inner boot was disloged during R&R that could cause a failure,
>> I believe?

>
>
>
> Not likely. Boot replacement requires removal of the inner joint before you
> can slide the boot off the outer one.


not true. the outer joint slide-hammers off the end of the shaft.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/38636024@N00/2500122861/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/3863602...n/photostream/

if you really wanted, though it would be somewhat inconvenient, you
could theoretically do this with the shaft still in the car.


> So generally you replace both inner
> and outer boots at once.


like replacing an oem coolant pump even though it's not defective.


>
> And in any case, actuall /breakage/ of either joint is unheard of with OEM,
> but is a possibility with aftermarket.
>


i've experienced it several times - but it was because the car's frame
was bent and the end was not seated properly in the end joint. the op
should check for such damage. broken motor mounts can cause this too.


--
nomina rutrum rutrum
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