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Old 28 Feb 2004, 09:06 am
gsp
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Default Electric Window Stuck Down

Hello,
Need help with 93 Civic LX; left rear electric window will not raise
using switch at either driver's door switch panel or rear left door switch.
Have full access to rear door panel. Left rear door lock is operable so
current is getting to the door panel; wires leading from door to center post
do not appear frayed. 20 Amp fuse for electric window intact. Trying just
to raise window to fully "up" position; if the window regulator is broken,
is there a way to manually raise the widow to the "up" position? Any help
with this would be appreciated. Haynes manual is not helping much.
George


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 28 Feb 2004, 09:46 am
'Curly Q. Links'
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Default Re: Electric Window Stuck Down

gsp wrote:
>
> Hello,
> Need help with 93 Civic LX; left rear electric window will not raise
> using switch at either driver's door switch panel or rear left door switch.
> Have full access to rear door panel. Left rear door lock is operable so
> current is getting to the door panel; wires leading from door to center post
> do not appear frayed. 20 Amp fuse for electric window intact. Trying just
> to raise window to fully "up" position; if the window regulator is broken,
> is there a way to manually raise the widow to the "up" position? Any help
> with this would be appreciated. Haynes manual is not helping much.
> George


===============

Sorry, I don't know the answer, :-) but the guys over at the VW
newsgroup might be able to help :-) since it happens to VWs about 200x
as often.

If you don't find a quick answer here, you could undo two or three
screws and wedge a piece of hockey stick (I'm not saying I hate hockey,
use bagpipes instead) under the sucker temporarily. Put a dab of contact
cenment on both ends of the stick or it will surely work itself loose
half-way to wherever you're going in a blizzard. (Murphy's Law)

'Curly'

===============
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 28 Feb 2004, 11:03 am
Cosmin N.
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Default Re: Electric Window Stuck Down

I'm not sure if this is the case, but check out the driver side door
switch. ALL other window switches connect to that one, so if that one's
faulty, it does not matter if the other switches work. Because of the
design of the switches in the older Hondas (at least in my 94 Accord and
most likely in your 93 as well), whenever you activate the switch a
small current arc forms, and it gradually burns the contact surface.
This leads to corrosion and eventually the switch fails completely. The
first indication is if the windows motors work a lot slower than usual
(corrosion leads to higher resistence on the circuit), and then it just
stopps working.

On my car the driver's side window switch was completely corroded, and
the others were well on their way as well. Honda wanted CAD$200 for a
new one. I took it apart, cleaned all the contacts and it still works
almost a year later. True, it was a real pain to get that switch apart
and then back together again, but it was worth it.

Cosmin

gsp wrote:

> Hello,
> Need help with 93 Civic LX; left rear electric window will not raise
> using switch at either driver's door switch panel or rear left door switch.
> Have full access to rear door panel. Left rear door lock is operable so
> current is getting to the door panel; wires leading from door to center post
> do not appear frayed. 20 Amp fuse for electric window intact. Trying just
> to raise window to fully "up" position; if the window regulator is broken,
> is there a way to manually raise the widow to the "up" position? Any help
> with this would be appreciated. Haynes manual is not helping much.
> George
>
>

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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 28 Feb 2004, 01:47 pm
Randolph
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Electric Window Stuck Down

The door locks and the power windows get power through separate wires
(they don't even share a ground lead) so the fact that the power locks
work does not mean much.

As you probably know, each window regulator has its own fuse. The fuse
for left rear is #7.

If you open up the rear door panel, try unplugging the wires to the
motor and measure the voltage at the wires as you operate the switches
(try both the one in the driver's door and the one in the left rear
door). On "UP" you should see battery voltage with positive at the
RED/YEL wire and negative at the RED/BLU wire. On "Down" you should get
the opposite polarity.

Measuring at the switch in the left rear door, there should be battery
voltage at YEL/BLK (with respect to ground) any time the ignition is on.
With the driver's door switch left alone there should be continuity to
ground on both the YEL and the YEL/GRN at the switch in the left rear
door.

To check the motor apply battery voltage to the terminals at the motor.
If nothing happens, reverse polarity and try again. If nothing happens
either way, your motor probably has failed.

Let me know if you want scans from the service manual.

gsp wrote:
>
> Hello,
> Need help with 93 Civic LX; left rear electric window will not raise
> using switch at either driver's door switch panel or rear left door switch.
> Have full access to rear door panel. Left rear door lock is operable so
> current is getting to the door panel; wires leading from door to center post
> do not appear frayed. 20 Amp fuse for electric window intact. Trying just
> to raise window to fully "up" position; if the window regulator is broken,
> is there a way to manually raise the widow to the "up" position? Any help
> with this would be appreciated. Haynes manual is not helping much.
> George

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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 28 Feb 2004, 07:05 pm
'Curly Q. Links'
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Electric Window Stuck Down

"Cosmin N." wrote:
>
> I'm not sure if this is the case, but check out the driver side door
> switch. ALL other window switches connect to that one, so if that one's
> faulty, it does not matter if the other switches work. Because of the
> design of the switches in the older Hondas (at least in my 94 Accord and
> most likely in your 93 as well), whenever you activate the switch a
> small current arc forms, and it gradually burns the contact surface.
> This leads to corrosion and eventually the switch fails completely. The
> first indication is if the windows motors work a lot slower than usual
> (corrosion leads to higher resistence on the circuit), and then it just
> stopps working.
>
> On my car the driver's side window switch was completely corroded, and
> the others were well on their way as well. Honda wanted CAD$200 for a
> new one. I took it apart, cleaned all the contacts and it still works
> almost a year later. True, it was a real pain to get that switch apart
> and then back together again, but it was worth it.
>
> Cosmin
>


===============

Cosmin, A buddy of mine turned me on to a device called a 'quench-arc',
which is simply a high value resistor with a capacitor in parallel, in a
package the size of a large resistor. Any time I overhaul anything with
'sparky' contacts, I install quencharcs across the contacts. Clothes
dryer timer, start winding switch on a washing machine, even the high
beam flasher switch comes to mind too.

Electronic stores sell them, but probably not Radio Shack: "You've got
Questions, We've got Acne"

'Curly'

===============
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 28 Feb 2004, 09:34 pm
Charlie S
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Electric Window Stuck Down

Randolph's comments are very good but I would like to add a couple of
comments:

1. If you don't have a multimeter, buy one. Even an inexpensive one
will work.

2. I think Randolph is suggesting that if you get a length of speaker
wire (two conductor), unplug the motor in the door. Stick one end of
each wire in the plug to the motor, at the other end touch the wires
to the battery and if nothing happens reverse the wires and try again.
By doing this you have bypassed all the contol switches.

3. Do grease all the moving parts on the window mechanism, use a white
lithium grease. A couple of months ago I repaired a 92 Accord window
by greasing it. It was a cheep fix.


On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:47:42 GMT, Randolph <trash@junkmail.com> wrote:

>The door locks and the power windows get power through separate wires
>(they don't even share a ground lead) so the fact that the power locks
>work does not mean much.
>
>As you probably know, each window regulator has its own fuse. The fuse
>for left rear is #7.
>
>If you open up the rear door panel, try unplugging the wires to the
>motor and measure the voltage at the wires as you operate the switches
>(try both the one in the driver's door and the one in the left rear
>door). On "UP" you should see battery voltage with positive at the
>RED/YEL wire and negative at the RED/BLU wire. On "Down" you should get
>the opposite polarity.
>
>Measuring at the switch in the left rear door, there should be battery
>voltage at YEL/BLK (with respect to ground) any time the ignition is on.
>With the driver's door switch left alone there should be continuity to
>ground on both the YEL and the YEL/GRN at the switch in the left rear
>door.
>
>To check the motor apply battery voltage to the terminals at the motor.
>If nothing happens, reverse polarity and try again. If nothing happens
>either way, your motor probably has failed.
>
>Let me know if you want scans from the service manual.
>
>gsp wrote:
>>
>> Hello,
>> Need help with 93 Civic LX; left rear electric window will not raise
>> using switch at either driver's door switch panel or rear left door switch.
>> Have full access to rear door panel. Left rear door lock is operable so
>> current is getting to the door panel; wires leading from door to center post
>> do not appear frayed. 20 Amp fuse for electric window intact. Trying just
>> to raise window to fully "up" position; if the window regulator is broken,
>> is there a way to manually raise the widow to the "up" position? Any help
>> with this would be appreciated. Haynes manual is not helping much.
>> George


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