Honda Car Forum

On Oct 19, 4:52*am, "Truckdude" <sa...@duh.com> wrote:
> "Brian Smith" <Hali...@NovaScotia.Canada> wrote in message
>
> news:gdavl5$2t9$1@news.datemas.de...
>
> > rev_otis_mcn...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> >> I care very much about conservation and environment, but it amazes me
> >> that no one here has understood my actual question about resetting.
> >> Honda owners? *I think I'll try some of the forums and hope for
> >> at least higher I.Q's.
>
> > I don't see what the big deal is about the maintenance minder. Keep track
> > of the distance and time since you did the last bit of maintenance to the
> > vehicle and forget about the *mm*. Just like in the good old days, depend
> > on written records or your memory and forget the new fangled gizmos. * :^)
>
> The computer takes into consideration accumulated engine revolutions and
> operating conditions. *Why is spacing oil changes based on an arbitrary
> amount of miles or time superior to that?

Here is the formula BMW uses for their oil change messaging:

e = a(1 + t + r) = estimated mileage

a= actual mileage

t = 1 if engine temp below operating temp, else t = 0

r = .5 if engine above 4500 RPM, else r = 0

You should see that this simple estimating formula pretty much
is sheer mileage-based for the average adult driver tooling around
town or out in the country. One of its major flaws is it doesn't
take into account engine run time (say, for a person who does
a lot of sitting daily in city traffic commuting).

rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Oct 19, 4:52�am, "Truckdude" <sa...@duh.com> wrote:
>> "Brian Smith" <Hali...@NovaScotia.Canada> wrote in message
>>
>> news:gdavl5$2t9$1@news.datemas.de...
>>
>>> rev_otis_mcn...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>>> I care very much about conservation and environment, but it amazes me
>>>> that no one here has understood my actual question about resetting.
>>>> Honda owners? �I think I'll try some of the forums and hope for
>>>> at least higher I.Q's.
>>> I don't see what the big deal is about the maintenance minder. Keep track
>>> of the distance and time since you did the last bit of maintenance to the
>>> vehicle and forget about the *mm*. Just like in the good old days, depend
>>> on written records or your memory and forget the new fangled gizmos. � :^)
>> The computer takes into consideration accumulated engine revolutions and
>> operating conditions. �Why is spacing oil changes based on an arbitrary
>> amount of miles or time superior to that?
>
> Here is the formula BMW uses for their oil change messaging:
>
> e = a(1 + t + r) = estimated mileage
>
> a= actual mileage
>
> t = 1 if engine temp below operating temp, else t = 0
>
> r = .5 if engine above 4500 RPM, else r = 0
>
> You should see that this simple estimating formula pretty much
> is sheer mileage-based for the average adult driver tooling around
> town or out in the country. One of its major flaws is it doesn't
> take into account engine run time (say, for a person who does
> a lot of sitting daily in city traffic commuting).

so where is your oil analysis? why does the "expert" change synthetic
oil after only 8.5k?

i'm unimpressed with your formula btw. that may have been an
approximation from back in the 70's, but we've moved on a little since
then...

rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Oct 18, 9:24�pm, Dillon Pyron <invaliddmpy...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
>>>> Actually the MM on my 2007 accord not only tracks oil life (pretty much
>>>> 7.5K/change) but also indicates other services by code (A1, B2, etc.)
>>> But these messages only show up when the MM says "Oil Life" at
>>> 15%-- or lower-- on your car, right? �They never show up independently
>>> w/o
>>> the MM saying it's time for an oil change.
>> Yes, because, if you do it according to Honda's recommendations, the
>> service intervals for the other items fall in line with the
>> recommended change times for oil.
>
> From previous post of mine, which addresses this--read slowly:
>
> "I think it's pretty clear to me now that this silly MM is just
> an oil change interval-based thingy that also keeps track
> of the overall mileage on the car (or maybe even the number
> of times the thing has been reset, to deal with the other
> items than need changing later--such as plugs and filters). "
>
> Assumes of course the owners waits till 15% on subsequent
> oil changes...
>
<snip crap>

let's go back to where all this b.s. started. you said:
"I am actually quite an expert on the subject of oil changes".

apparently that's not true since you don't seem to know /why/ oil needs
to get changed - and no, it's not the color - or seem to bother with oil
analysis.

basically dude, if you don't know stuff, that's fine, but don't try to
bullshit your way out of the corner you've painted yourself into. and
/definitely/ don't try to bullshit people that /do/ know more than you.
if you bothered to pay attention, maybe you'd even learn something.

In article <fzCKk.195284$vK2.66331@en-nntp-03.dc1.easynews.com>,
"Truckdude" <sarah@duh.com> wrote:

> The computer takes into consideration accumulated engine revolutions and
> operating conditions. Why is spacing oil changes based on an arbitrary
> amount of miles or time superior to that?

Because Brian and Otis KNOW BETTER, didn't you read? They're EXPERTS.

And you know, it isn't every day that you run across EXPERTS on the
Usenet. Cherish the time they spend with us.

In article
<69be4364-045d-4a60-b6e6-ad858deec8f0@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>,
rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com wrote:

> Here is the formula BMW uses for their oil change messaging:

Is that current?

And how does that matter to how Honda does it?

"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:y_qdnYBkIY_mOWfVnZ2dnUVZ_rTinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>L Alpert wrote:
>> <rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:43032a22-7e4d-4d32-b2bd-aab840011edf@64g2000hsu.googlegroups.com...
>>> On Oct 17, 12:49 pm, "L Alpert" <alpe...@xxgmail.com> wrote:
>>>> <rev_otis_mcn...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>
>>>> news:928a3efb-5e2d-457b-965f-6e5e7b22fa66@t39g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
>>>> On Oct 15, 2:38 am, "Justbob30" <justbo...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I care very much about conservation and environment, but it
>>>> amazes me
>>>> that no one here has understood my actual question about
>>>> resetting.
>>>> Honda owners? I think I'll try some of the forums and hope for
>>>> at least higher I.Q's.
>>>> ------------
>>>>
>>>> I fully understand what you are asking, it is a pretty straight
>>>> forward question. Does resetting the maintanance reminder at an
>>>> oil
>>>> change interval reset the reminder of those items scheduled
>>>> further
>>>> out then said oil change?
>>>>
>>>> Unfortunately, I don't have the answer!
>>> I think it's pretty clear to me now that this silly MM is just
>>> an oil change interval-based thingy that also keeps track
>>> of the overall mileage on the car (or maybe even the number
>>> of times the thing has been reset, to deal with the other
>>> items than need changing later--such as plugs and filters).
>>> For a person who does not wish to wait for the Oil Life to
>>> get down to 15% on the MM before changing his oil, he will
>>> never see reminders for changing out the other items, rotating
>>> tires, etc.
>>> Let us say there are flaws in the system.
>>>
>>
>> With the technology that is available today, it would be relatively
>> easy to design a truly automated system.
>
> not only is it easy, you'd be damned foolish /not/ to use such a
> system given the computing power the vehicle has.

I'd like to see it integrated into the touch screen for vehicles with
the navi system.

L Alpert wrote:
> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> news:y_qdnYBkIY_mOWfVnZ2dnUVZ_rTinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>> L Alpert wrote:
>>> <rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>> news:43032a22-7e4d-4d32-b2bd-aab840011edf@64g2000hsu.googlegroups.com...
>>>> On Oct 17, 12:49 pm, "L Alpert" <alpe...@xxgmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> <rev_otis_mcn...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>
>>>>> news:928a3efb-5e2d-457b-965f-6e5e7b22fa66@t39g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
>>>>> On Oct 15, 2:38 am, "Justbob30" <justbo...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I care very much about conservation and environment, but it
>>>>> amazes me
>>>>> that no one here has understood my actual question about
>>>>> resetting.
>>>>> Honda owners? I think I'll try some of the forums and hope for
>>>>> at least higher I.Q's.
>>>>> ------------
>>>>>
>>>>> I fully understand what you are asking, it is a pretty straight
>>>>> forward question. Does resetting the maintanance reminder at an
>>>>> oil
>>>>> change interval reset the reminder of those items scheduled
>>>>> further
>>>>> out then said oil change?
>>>>>
>>>>> Unfortunately, I don't have the answer!
>>>> I think it's pretty clear to me now that this silly MM is just
>>>> an oil change interval-based thingy that also keeps track
>>>> of the overall mileage on the car (or maybe even the number
>>>> of times the thing has been reset, to deal with the other
>>>> items than need changing later--such as plugs and filters).
>>>> For a person who does not wish to wait for the Oil Life to
>>>> get down to 15% on the MM before changing his oil, he will
>>>> never see reminders for changing out the other items, rotating
>>>> tires, etc.
>>>> Let us say there are flaws in the system.
>>>>
>>> With the technology that is available today, it would be relatively
>>> easy to design a truly automated system.
>> not only is it easy, you'd be damned foolish /not/ to use such a
>> system given the computing power the vehicle has.
>
> I'd like to see it integrated into the touch screen for vehicles with
> the navi system.
>
>

i'm sure it'll happen, but the problem is that the navigation system is
a specialist package, just like the engine management system is a
specialist package. the guys that design one, don't design the other.
to integrate them means having them both hosted by yet another system.
then you're looking at a car whose software takes 4 minutes to boot
before the engine runs and... well, it won't be that bad, but "modular"
and "stand alone" make a lot of sense.

Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>
> Because Brian and Otis KNOW BETTER, didn't you read? They're EXPERTS.

Not necessarily experts, but we apparently know what works the best for
our applications and that is the bottom line.

> And you know, it isn't every day that you run across EXPERTS on the
> Usenet. Cherish the time they spend with us.

In much the same way in which we cherish the amount of time you not
necessarily yourself, but certainly little Jimmy spends here dispensing
*wisdom*.

"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:ZOqdnXqGtoJ03WbVnZ2dnUVZ_qHinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>L Alpert wrote:
>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>> news:y_qdnYBkIY_mOWfVnZ2dnUVZ_rTinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>>> L Alpert wrote:
>>>> <rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:43032a22-7e4d-4d32-b2bd-aab840011edf@64g2000hsu.googlegroups.com...
>>>>> On Oct 17, 12:49 pm, "L Alpert" <alpe...@xxgmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> <rev_otis_mcn...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>
>>>>>> news:928a3efb-5e2d-457b-965f-6e5e7b22fa66@t39g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>> On Oct 15, 2:38 am, "Justbob30" <justbo...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I care very much about conservation and environment, but it
>>>>>> amazes me
>>>>>> that no one here has understood my actual question about
>>>>>> resetting.
>>>>>> Honda owners? I think I'll try some of the forums and hope for
>>>>>> at least higher I.Q's.
>>>>>> ------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I fully understand what you are asking, it is a pretty straight
>>>>>> forward question. Does resetting the maintanance reminder at
>>>>>> an oil
>>>>>> change interval reset the reminder of those items scheduled
>>>>>> further
>>>>>> out then said oil change?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Unfortunately, I don't have the answer!
>>>>> I think it's pretty clear to me now that this silly MM is just
>>>>> an oil change interval-based thingy that also keeps track
>>>>> of the overall mileage on the car (or maybe even the number
>>>>> of times the thing has been reset, to deal with the other
>>>>> items than need changing later--such as plugs and filters).
>>>>> For a person who does not wish to wait for the Oil Life to
>>>>> get down to 15% on the MM before changing his oil, he will
>>>>> never see reminders for changing out the other items, rotating
>>>>> tires, etc.
>>>>> Let us say there are flaws in the system.
>>>>>
>>>> With the technology that is available today, it would be
>>>> relatively easy to design a truly automated system.
>>> not only is it easy, you'd be damned foolish /not/ to use such a
>>> system given the computing power the vehicle has.
>>
>> I'd like to see it integrated into the touch screen for vehicles
>> with the navi system.
>
> i'm sure it'll happen, but the problem is that the navigation system
> is a specialist package, just like the engine management system is a
> specialist package. the guys that design one, don't design the
> other. to integrate them means having them both hosted by yet
> another system. then you're looking at a car whose software takes 4
> minutes to boot before the engine runs and... well, it won't be
> that bad, but "modular" and "stand alone" make a lot of sense.

My '04 Navi takes about 30 seconds to load and be useful, which also
includes all of the controls for a lot of other functions (though
there are push button controls available as well, but they're no fun
to use!).

In a not too distant future, touchscreen controls will be common place
for even low end models as they become less expensive and easier to
program and wire to PLC type controls (I frequently use them for
equipment designs, and small touch screens can be had quite cheaply
these days, as well as PLC controls). All that is needed to interface
the two is a network cable.

>

In article <gdffqi$d3s$1@news.datemas.de>,
Brian Smith <Halifax@NovaScotia.Canada> wrote:

> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
> >
> > Because Brian and Otis KNOW BETTER, didn't you read? They're EXPERTS.
>
> Not necessarily experts, but we apparently know what works the best for
> our applications and that is the bottom line.

Absolutely. Because you know EVERYTHING about how your engine is
designed and manufactured--more so than even the engineers who designed
it.



>
> > And you know, it isn't every day that you run across EXPERTS on the
> > Usenet. Cherish the time they spend with us.
>
> In much the same way in which we cherish the amount of time you not
> necessarily yourself, but certainly little Jimmy spends here dispensing
> *wisdom*.

Oh no, we cherish the time YOU choose to spend here, dispensing your
wisdom.