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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 20 Aug 2008, 07:17 am
Robert11
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Default Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

Hello,

Real amateur when it comes to negotiating for a new car.
In my 70's now, not that sharp with negotiating, and would appreciate any
opinions on this:

I see in the various Forums and newsgroups that an "appropriate" first offer
on a new car would be perhaps 500 max. over the Dealers Invoice. Seems to
be a magic number.

How is the Dest. charge handled ?

Would this 500 over invoice offer figure include the destination charge
which seems to run about 700 these days, or is the dest charge (usually)
added on to whatever price you and the dealer agree upon ?

Thanks,
B.


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 20 Aug 2008, 08:25 am
Elmo P. Shagnasty
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Default Re: Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

In article <OICdna-TSuPTljHVnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d@comcast.com>,
"Robert11" <rgsros@notme.com> wrote:

> I see in the various Forums and newsgroups that an "appropriate" first offer
> on a new car would be perhaps 500 max. over the Dealers Invoice. Seems to
> be a magic number.
>
> How is the Dest. charge handled ?


It's an absolute; it has to be listed on the sales paperwork directly.
The car price, invoice or otherwise, is separate from the destination
charge.

Thank you, unions.



> Would this 500 over invoice offer figure include the destination charge
> which seems to run about 700 these days, or is the dest charge (usually)
> added on to whatever price you and the dealer agree upon ?


Added on.

http://www.edmunds.com even shows it that way in their listings.
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 20 Aug 2008, 08:41 am
jim beam
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Default Re: Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
> In article <OICdna-TSuPTljHVnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d@comcast.com>,
> "Robert11" <rgsros@notme.com> wrote:
>
>> I see in the various Forums and newsgroups that an "appropriate" first offer
>> on a new car would be perhaps 500 max. over the Dealers Invoice. Seems to
>> be a magic number.
>>
>> How is the Dest. charge handled ?

>
> It's an absolute; it has to be listed on the sales paperwork directly.
> The car price, invoice or otherwise, is separate from the destination
> charge.
>
> Thank you, unions.
>
>
>
>> Would this 500 over invoice offer figure include the destination charge
>> which seems to run about 700 these days, or is the dest charge (usually)
>> added on to whatever price you and the dealer agree upon ?

>
> Added on.
>
> http://www.edmunds.com even shows it that way in their listings.



"dealer invoice" is a ridiculous price fixing mechanism. reality is,
there's no way dealers can pay their real estate costs, advertising,
sales staff and cost of inventory for a mere $700. absolutely no way.
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 20 Aug 2008, 09:09 am
Elle
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Default Re: Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

The April issue of Consumer Reports has info on this.
April's issue is always the annual "car buying" issue.
Public libraries keep these at the reference desk or in the
magazine section.


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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 20 Aug 2008, 10:35 am
Elmo P. Shagnasty
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Default Re: Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

In article <zamdnXC128KzgjHVnZ2dnUVZ_tzinZ2d@speakeasy.net> ,
jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:

> "dealer invoice" is a ridiculous price fixing mechanism.


Agreed.

I'm amazed at people who swear by a number that's written on paper.
"I'd never pay sticker, by definition that's a ripoff." Well.....with a
high demand car, it may reflect the market value of the car. Hell,
sticker may be UNDER market value!

Those same people swear by "I'll pay $200 over invoice, nothing
more"--without realizing that they've conditioned the carmakers to
"release" this number they call "invoice" price, which in reality is--ta
daaa--just another sticker price.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 20 Aug 2008, 01:58 pm
Larry in AZ
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

Waiving the right to remain silent, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> said:

> In article <zamdnXC128KzgjHVnZ2dnUVZ_tzinZ2d@speakeasy.net> ,
> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>
>> "dealer invoice" is a ridiculous price fixing mechanism.

>
> Agreed.
>
> I'm amazed at people who swear by a number that's written on paper.
> "I'd never pay sticker, by definition that's a ripoff." Well.....with a
> high demand car, it may reflect the market value of the car. Hell,
> sticker may be UNDER market value!
>
> Those same people swear by "I'll pay $200 over invoice, nothing
> more"--without realizing that they've conditioned the carmakers to
> "release" this number they call "invoice" price, which in reality is--ta
> daaa--just another sticker price.


You'd need to be the accounant at a dealership to know what they really paid
for a car...

--
Larry J. - Remove spamtrap in ALLCAPS to e-mail

"A lack of common sense is now considered a disability,
with all the privileges that this entails."
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 20 Aug 2008, 03:37 pm
Flatus Johnson
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

"Robert11" <rgsros@notme.com> wrote in message
news:OICdna-TSuPTljHVnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Hello,
>
> Real amateur when it comes to negotiating for a new car.
> In my 70's now, not that sharp with negotiating, and would appreciate any
> opinions on this:
>
> I see in the various Forums and newsgroups that an "appropriate" first
> offer
> on a new car would be perhaps 500 max. over the Dealers Invoice. Seems to
> be a magic number.
>
> How is the Dest. charge handled ?
>
> Would this 500 over invoice offer figure include the destination charge
> which seems to run about 700 these days, or is the dest charge (usually)
> added on to whatever price you and the dealer agree upon ?
>
> Thanks,
> B.
>
>


Sounds like you might want to take someone with you-- a shrewd
relative/friend, etc.


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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 21 Aug 2008, 08:06 am
jim beam
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

Larry in AZ wrote:
> Waiving the right to remain silent, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
> <elmop@nastydesigns.com> said:
>
>> In article <zamdnXC128KzgjHVnZ2dnUVZ_tzinZ2d@speakeasy.net> ,
>> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>
>>> "dealer invoice" is a ridiculous price fixing mechanism.

>> Agreed.
>>
>> I'm amazed at people who swear by a number that's written on paper.
>> "I'd never pay sticker, by definition that's a ripoff." Well.....with a
>> high demand car, it may reflect the market value of the car. Hell,
>> sticker may be UNDER market value!
>>
>> Those same people swear by "I'll pay $200 over invoice, nothing
>> more"--without realizing that they've conditioned the carmakers to
>> "release" this number they call "invoice" price, which in reality is--ta
>> daaa--just another sticker price.

>
> You'd need to be the accounant at a dealership to know what they really paid
> for a car...
>


as i understand it, they don't even pay, they just sell it, then remit
an agreed amount back to the manufacturer.
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 21 Aug 2008, 12:59 pm
Larry in AZ
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

Waiving the right to remain silent, jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net>
said:

> Larry in AZ wrote:
>> Waiving the right to remain silent, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
>> <elmop@nastydesigns.com> said:
>>
>>> In article <zamdnXC128KzgjHVnZ2dnUVZ_tzinZ2d@speakeasy.net> , jim beam
>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "dealer invoice" is a ridiculous price fixing mechanism.
>>> Agreed.
>>>
>>> I'm amazed at people who swear by a number that's written on paper.
>>> "I'd never pay sticker, by definition that's a ripoff." Well.....with
>>> a high demand car, it may reflect the market value of the car. Hell,
>>> sticker may be UNDER market value!
>>>
>>> Those same people swear by "I'll pay $200 over invoice, nothing
>>> more"--without realizing that they've conditioned the carmakers to
>>> "release" this number they call "invoice" price, which in reality
>>> is--ta daaa--just another sticker price.

>>
>> You'd need to be the accounant at a dealership to know what they really
>> paid for a car...
>>

>
> as i understand it, they don't even pay, they just sell it, then remit
> an agreed amount back to the manufacturer.


That would depend on the dealer's contract with the manufacturer. I could
see some of them even being on COD if their credit isn't very shiny...

--
Larry J. - Remove spamtrap in ALLCAPS to e-mail

"A lack of common sense is now considered a disability,
with all the privileges that this entails."
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 21 Aug 2008, 10:22 pm
jim beam
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Sr. Citizen's Question On Car Pricing ?

Larry in AZ wrote:
> Waiving the right to remain silent, jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net>
> said:
>
>> Larry in AZ wrote:
>>> Waiving the right to remain silent, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
>>> <elmop@nastydesigns.com> said:
>>>
>>>> In article <zamdnXC128KzgjHVnZ2dnUVZ_tzinZ2d@speakeasy.net> , jim beam
>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> "dealer invoice" is a ridiculous price fixing mechanism.
>>>> Agreed.
>>>>
>>>> I'm amazed at people who swear by a number that's written on paper.
>>>> "I'd never pay sticker, by definition that's a ripoff." Well.....with
>>>> a high demand car, it may reflect the market value of the car. Hell,
>>>> sticker may be UNDER market value!
>>>>
>>>> Those same people swear by "I'll pay $200 over invoice, nothing
>>>> more"--without realizing that they've conditioned the carmakers to
>>>> "release" this number they call "invoice" price, which in reality
>>>> is--ta daaa--just another sticker price.
>>> You'd need to be the accounant at a dealership to know what they really
>>> paid for a car...
>>>

>> as i understand it, they don't even pay, they just sell it, then remit
>> an agreed amount back to the manufacturer.

>
> That would depend on the dealer's contract with the manufacturer. I could
> see some of them even being on COD if their credit isn't very shiny...
>



why would they bother with cod if that dealer isn't much good? surely
they'd want to retain ownership?
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