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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 09 Jan 2007, 08:51 am
jkolnos9000@gmail.com
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Default 92 Accord won't start but will run

I have a strange starting problem on a 92 Accord. When I try to start
it it cranks just fine but refuses to start as if the fuel or ignition
system is off. However sometimes while trying to start it it randomly
will stumble(fire as if it had a lot of drag) and then it will run fine
without skipping or stalling.
I have already fixed the fuel pump relay and can see that gas is
reaching the injectors okay. I'm wondering what actually changes
between 'starting' and 'running' that may cause this problem. If I let
the car warm up then stop it, it will usually start after cranking for
5-6 seconds.


Thanks

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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 09 Jan 2007, 06:00 pm
NoMoreRGS
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Default Re: 92 Accord won't start but will run

Ignition switch? The car is known for having ignition switch
failures.

When you say the fuel pump relay do you mean the main relay located
under the dash by the steering column(a double relay)? If not the
original main relay is known for developing cracks in the solder
joints. Replacements probably have the problem solved.


On 9 Jan 2007 06:51:23 -0800, jkolnos9000@gmail.com wrote:

>I have a strange starting problem on a 92 Accord. When I try to start
>it it cranks just fine but refuses to start as if the fuel or ignition
>system is off. However sometimes while trying to start it it randomly
>will stumble(fire as if it had a lot of drag) and then it will run fine
>without skipping or stalling.
> I have already fixed the fuel pump relay and can see that gas is
>reaching the injectors okay. I'm wondering what actually changes
>between 'starting' and 'running' that may cause this problem. If I let
>the car warm up then stop it, it will usually start after cranking for
>5-6 seconds.
>
>
>Thanks

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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 10 Jan 2007, 06:54 am
Michael Pardee
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Default Re: 92 Accord won't start but will run

<jkolnos9000@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1168354283.416217.308430@38g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com...
>I have a strange starting problem on a 92 Accord. When I try to start
> it it cranks just fine but refuses to start as if the fuel or ignition
> system is off. However sometimes while trying to start it it randomly
> will stumble(fire as if it had a lot of drag) and then it will run fine
> without skipping or stalling.
> I have already fixed the fuel pump relay and can see that gas is
> reaching the injectors okay. I'm wondering what actually changes
> between 'starting' and 'running' that may cause this problem. If I let
> the car warm up then stop it, it will usually start after cranking for
> 5-6 seconds.
>
>
> Thanks
>

The subject line had me going for a moment, like "dead man wins race!" Now I
see what you're getting at.

When you say it "run[s] fine" once started I assume you also mean it has
normal power and idles when you come to a stop without any trouble. If so,
this suggests to me one of two fuel problems; the engine could be flooding
because of leaky injectors or the fuel pressure in the rails could be
bleeding off. Try this test: crank the engine for about a second, let off
(ignition in the "run" position) for a second or two and then try to start.
If that works reliably the problem is that the fuel pressure is bleeding
off. It could be a leaky injector or a leaky check valve on the fuel pump.
Apparently ECUs get confused when the engine doesn't start quickly and they
start adjusting the injection over a wide range. I've had a car (Nissan)
that simply wouldn't start no matter how long I cranked unless I bumped the
starter first. That was only a problem when I had opened the fuel rail, but
it had me going at first!

If that doesn't work, hold the accelerator wide open while trying to start.
If that gets the engine started (may take several seconds) the engine is
flooding because of leaky injectors. Flooding will produce black smoke out
the tailpipe when the engine starts but it may take an observer to see it.

In either case, adding a bottle of fuel injector cleaner couldn't hurt, may
help either condition.

Mike


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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 11 Jan 2007, 08:50 am
jkolnos9000@gmail.com
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Default Re: 92 Accord won't start but will run

> When you say the fuel pump relay do you mean the main relay located
> under the dash by the steering column(a double relay)?
>


Yes. I had that problem where it wouldn't fire at all on warm days. I
resoldered the joints on the relay and it worked fine. This newer
problem is different in that the engine stumbles for a second or two
before actually starting(when it does start). I'll look into the
ignition though.

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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 11 Jan 2007, 06:07 pm
NoMoreRGS
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Default Re: 92 Accord won't start but will run


On 11 Jan 2007 06:50:23 -0800, jkolnos9000@gmail.com wrote:

>> When you say the fuel pump relay do you mean the main relay located
>> under the dash by the steering column(a double relay)?
>>

>
>Yes. I had that problem where it wouldn't fire at all on warm days. I
>resoldered the joints on the relay and it worked fine. This newer
>problem is different in that the engine stumbles for a second or two
>before actually starting(when it does start). I'll look into the
>ignition though.



Also take a look inside the distributor car for any oil or orange/red
dust (seal and bearing failure).

I have a '91 DX (105,000 miles) and have changed the main relay
(problem similar you previous problem), the distributor, cleaned the
EGR runners (1/3-1/2 clogged), but have not touched the ignition
switch yet.

The distributor was creating a very intermittent problem for my wife.
I would test drive the car when she complained that it ran funny at
slow speeds and almost stalled at times but it ran perfect for me
every time. I did notice it once and immediately got the check engine
light. When jumping the connector under the right side of the glove
box I got three error codes.

Two of the codes were for sensors inside the distributor (crank angle
and maybe TDC?). When I opened the distributor cap I found orange
dust and some oil inside. No wonder it didn't want to run correctly!
I replaced the complete distributor with a used one from a car salvage
yard ($175 the bastards). I couldn't turn the shaft of the
distributor by hand when it was out of the car so it was very close to
getting stuck and needing a tow.

Six months later an intermittent stumbling problem occurred when the
car was warm and under load at low RPM's. I couldn't find that
problem right away either. I changed plugs, wires, tried the old
coil, cleaned EGR passage way runners (also a somewhat common problem)
and even the ECU ($175 used Internet car parts place). But none of
these things fixed it the problem. I learned later that ECU's rarely
go bad in Honda's.

Then I bought a used complete distributor off EBay for $50 out of
desperation which solved the problem. It must have been the
electronic stuff inside the replacement distributor that was caused
the problem. It's been good for about three years now.


Let us know how you make out.

P.S.
It is still the best and most reliable car I've ever owned.

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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 14 Jan 2007, 10:45 pm
jkolnos9000@gmail.com
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: 92 Accord won't start but will run

Michael Pardee wrote:

> When you say it "run[s] fine" once started I assume you also mean it has
> normal power and idles when you come to a stop without any trouble.


Yes. I haven't noticed any particular loss of power since this problem
started however I did notice this problem came on gradually. For about
3 weeks before, starting the car in the morning took 1-2 seconds
longer. I had a habit of only engaging the starter for a certain amount
of time instead of until the engine started and that didn't work
anymore.

> If so,
> this suggests to me one of two fuel problems; the engine could be flooding
> because of leaky injectors or the fuel pressure in the rails could be
> bleeding off. Try this test: crank the engine for about a second, let off
> (ignition in the "run" position) for a second or two and then try to start.
> If that works reliably the problem is that the fuel pressure is bleeding
> off.


I read about this in another FAQ. I cycled the pump 8 times before
starting and no luck.

> It could be a leaky injector or a leaky check valve on the fuel pump.
> Apparently ECUs get confused when the engine doesn't start quickly and they
> start adjusting the injection over a wide range. I've had a car (Nissan)
> that simply wouldn't start no matter how long I cranked unless I bumped the
> starter first. That was only a problem when I had opened the fuel rail, but
> it had me going at first!
> If that doesn't work, hold the accelerator wide open while trying to start.
> If that gets the engine started (may take several seconds) the engine is
> flooding because of leaky injectors. Flooding will produce black smoke out
> the tailpipe when the engine starts but it may take an observer to see it.


This worked. It also caused unburned fuel/air to come out of the
intake. The next 4 times I started the car I floored it until it fired
then started normally and it ran fine. However the fifth time it
doesn't want to go. If the injectors are leaking I am concerned about
hydrolock although I suppose most of the fuel will flow back into the
intake manifold. Would a faulty fuel pressure regulator cause this?

>
> In either case, adding a bottle of fuel injector cleaner couldn't hurt, may
> help either condition.
>
> Mike


I'll give it a try. Thanks for all your help!

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