Honda Car Forum

Took my 99 Accord V6 to the dealer today for an "express" oil change
that turned into a longer wait than expected. When the service advisor
came out, he showed me samples from my power steering fluid and
transmission fluid compared to samples from new fluids, and recommended
that both systems be flushed.

I just recently had a 90K mile service done on the car at the same
dealer, and one of the services that was performed then was a drain-and-
fill on the transmission. I told the advisor this, and he said they
still recommended a flush. Given the well-documented fragility of the V6
auto trannies, and the comments I've read here in the past advising
against flushes, I declined to have this done. Is there anyone who has
anything positive to say about flushing, other than the shops for whom
it appears to be a nice profit generator?

Power steering flush I'm not sure about - does the power steering system
really require flushing, or is it like the trans where a drain-and-fill
is just as effective, if not better? This particular dealer wants $140
to do the power steering flush. I opted to do nothing for now except the
oil change I'd come in for, pending further research. I also suspected
that if the power steering fluid really needed to be changed, it would
have been mentioned when the 90K service was done.

Dave

On 12/28/06 4:14 PM, in article MPG.1ffdfdbcda71ac0298a13d@207.14.116.130,
"Dave Garrett" <dave@compassnet.com> wrote:

> Took my 99 Accord V6 to the dealer today for an "express" oil change
> that turned into a longer wait than expected. When the service advisor
> came out, he showed me samples from my power steering fluid and
> transmission fluid compared to samples from new fluids, and recommended
> that both systems be flushed.
>
> I just recently had a 90K mile service done on the car at the same
> dealer, and one of the services that was performed then was a drain-and-
> fill on the transmission. I told the advisor this, and he said they
> still recommended a flush. Given the well-documented fragility of the V6
> auto trannies, and the comments I've read here in the past advising
> against flushes, I declined to have this done. Is there anyone who has
> anything positive to say about flushing, other than the shops for whom
> it appears to be a nice profit generator?

When the transmission fluid is changed with the drain and fill method, it
has to be done several times to actually change all the fluid. Normally
three drain & fills will get it all. The service manual specifies that the
procedure be repeated until the fluid is the right color and smell.
Apparently, your dealer only did it once and that did not replace enough of
it to clean it up.

Unless the guidance has changed recently, Honda does not recommend flushing,
but rather repeated drain & fill until it cleans up.
>
> Power steering flush I'm not sure about - does the power steering system
> really require flushing, or is it like the trans where a drain-and-fill
> is just as effective, if not better? This particular dealer wants $140
> to do the power steering flush. I opted to do nothing for now except the
> oil change I'd come in for, pending further research. I also suspected
> that if the power steering fluid really needed to be changed, it would
> have been mentioned when the 90K service was done.
>

There is nothing in the service schedules for any of my cars (including the
'06 Honda) about periodically changing power steering fluid & I've never
changed any. I've seen this come up occasionally just in the past couple of
years. Does anybody know what is prompting this new maintenance issue?

> Dave
>

Dave Garrett wrote:
>
> Took my 99 Accord V6 to the dealer today for an "express" oil change
> that turned into a longer wait than expected. When the service advisor
> came out, he showed me samples from my power steering fluid and
> transmission fluid compared to samples from new fluids, and recommended
> that both systems be flushed.
>
> I just recently had a 90K mile service done on the car at the same
> dealer, and one of the services that was performed then was a drain-and-
> fill on the transmission. I told the advisor this, and he said they
> still recommended a flush. Given the well-documented fragility of the V6
> auto trannies, and the comments I've read here in the past advising
> against flushes, I declined to have this done. Is there anyone who has
> anything positive to say about flushing, other than the shops for whom
> it appears to be a nice profit generator?
>
> Power steering flush I'm not sure about - does the power steering system
> really require flushing, or is it like the trans where a drain-and-fill
> is just as effective, if not better? This particular dealer wants $140
> to do the power steering flush. I opted to do nothing for now except the
> oil change I'd come in for, pending further research. I also suspected
> that if the power steering fluid really needed to be changed, it would
> have been mentioned when the 90K service was done.
>

A power steering flush is a fairly common procedure. A standard
recommendation is to do it every 5 years or 50,000 miles. The procedure is
outlined in the Helm factory service manual. It uses the power steering
pump to flush the fluid and not an external machine so there is no danger of
forcing fluid through the system in a way for which is was not designed.

With regards to the transmission flush, I would avoid it and follow the
recommendations of the other posters. Three to four fluid changes, drain
and refills, should get most of the old fluid out.

Eric

Flushing machines are cash cows at the dealers. Flushing can force
particles into valve bodies I wouldn't do it on any car. Three repeated
drains and refills over short intervals should do the trick. On for
cars with removable pans, drop and clean the pan and change the
filter/strainer.

PS flush is outlined but I'm not aware of any recommendation to do so.
What I had done was siphon the fluid out of the reservoir every other
oil change. It's not much, but quick and easy.


Dave Garrett wrote:
> Took my 99 Accord V6 to the dealer today for an "express" oil change
> that turned into a longer wait than expected. When the service advisor
> came out, he showed me samples from my power steering fluid and
> transmission fluid compared to samples from new fluids, and recommended
> that both systems be flushed.
>
> I just recently had a 90K mile service done on the car at the same
> dealer, and one of the services that was performed then was a drain-and-
> fill on the transmission. I told the advisor this, and he said they
> still recommended a flush. Given the well-documented fragility of the V6
> auto trannies, and the comments I've read here in the past advising
> against flushes, I declined to have this done. Is there anyone who has
> anything positive to say about flushing, other than the shops for whom
> it appears to be a nice profit generator?
>
> Power steering flush I'm not sure about - does the power steering system
> really require flushing, or is it like the trans where a drain-and-fill
> is just as effective, if not better? This particular dealer wants $140
> to do the power steering flush. I opted to do nothing for now except the
> oil change I'd come in for, pending further research. I also suspected
> that if the power steering fluid really needed to be changed, it would
> have been mentioned when the 90K service was done.
>
> Dave

E Meyer wrote:
> There is nothing in the service schedules for any of my cars (including the
> '06 Honda) about periodically changing power steering fluid & I've never
> changed any. I've seen this come up occasionally just in the past couple of
> years. Does anybody know what is prompting this new maintenance issue?
>
=====================================

Ummm, Dealers realized they were _mi$$ing an opportunity _ to lighten
the customer's wallet just a little more?

My be$t Gue$$

'Curly'

On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 07:26:21 -0700, motsco_ wrote:

> E Meyer wrote:
>> There is nothing in the service schedules for any of my cars (including the
>> '06 Honda) about periodically changing power steering fluid & I've never
>> changed any. I've seen this come up occasionally just in the past couple of
>> years. Does anybody know what is prompting this new maintenance issue?
>>
> =====================================
>
> Ummm, Dealers realized they were _mi$$ing an opportunity _ to lighten
> the customer's wallet just a little more?
>
> My be$t Gue$$

Probably an accurate one, but one that the local quick lube places were
hitting before the dealers thought of it.

My local Valvoline used to ask me if I wanted the Power Steering fluid
replaced at just about every oil change.

Funny thing is, though, I've never even seen the slightest discoloration
in Power Steering fluid...

On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 07:26:21 -0700, motsco_ <motsco_@interbaun.com>
wrote:

>E Meyer wrote:
>> There is nothing in the service schedules for any of my cars (including the
>> '06 Honda) about periodically changing power steering fluid & I've never
>> changed any. I've seen this come up occasionally just in the past couple of
>> years. Does anybody know what is prompting this new maintenance issue?
>>
>=====================================
>
>Ummm, Dealers realized they were _mi$$ing an opportunity _ to lighten
>the customer's wallet just a little more?
>
>My be$t Gue$$
>
>'Curly'

And a lighter wallet means faster acceleration, better gas mileage and
less wear on the suspension. They really are looking out for the
customer.

On Thu, 28 Dec 2006 22:05:38 -0800, johngdole wrote:

> Flushing machines are cash cows at the dealers. Flushing can force
> particles into valve bodies I wouldn't do it on any car. Three repeated
> drains and refills over short intervals should do the trick. On for
> cars with removable pans, drop and clean the pan and change the
> filter/strainer.
>
> PS flush is outlined but I'm not aware of any recommendation to do so.
> What I had done was siphon the fluid out of the reservoir every other
> oil change. It's not much, but quick and easy.
>
>
> Dave Garrett wrote:
>> Took my 99 Accord V6 to the dealer today for an "express" oil change
>> that turned into a longer wait than expected. When the service advisor
>> came out, he showed me samples from my power steering fluid and
>> transmission fluid compared to samples from new fluids, and recommended
>> that both systems be flushed.
>>
>> I just recently had a 90K mile service done on the car at the same
>> dealer, and one of the services that was performed then was a drain-and-
>> fill on the transmission. I told the advisor this, and he said they
>> still recommended a flush. Given the well-documented fragility of the V6
>> auto trannies, and the comments I've read here in the past advising
>> against flushes, I declined to have this done. Is there anyone who has
>> anything positive to say about flushing, other than the shops for whom
>> it appears to be a nice profit generator?
>>
>> Power steering flush I'm not sure about - does the power steering system
>> really require flushing, or is it like the trans where a drain-and-fill
>> is just as effective, if not better? This particular dealer wants $140
>> to do the power steering flush. I opted to do nothing for now except the
>> oil change I'd come in for, pending further research. I also suspected
>> that if the power steering fluid really needed to be changed, it would
>> have been mentioned when the 90K service was done.
>>
>> Dave

But what is the benefit? Every power steering failure I've ever had was
from rust on the outside eating through the pump. And that was on Dodges...

Dave Garrett <dave@compassnet.com> wrote in
news:MPG.1ffdfdbcda71ac0298a13d@207.14.116.130:

> Took my 99 Accord V6 to the dealer today for an "express" oil change
> that turned into a longer wait than expected. When the service advisor
> came out, he showed me samples from my power steering fluid and
> transmission fluid compared to samples from new fluids, and
> recommended that both systems be flushed.


OK...


>
> I just recently had a 90K mile service done on the car at the same
> dealer, and one of the services that was performed then was a
> drain-and- fill on the transmission.



Provided this "drain and fill" was done correctly, you're fine as-is.



> I told the advisor this, and he said they
> still recommended a flush.



Sorry, but the rip-off buzzer is sounding just now. Ask him how many
times they did the "drain and fill" procedure. It needs to be done a few
times in succession to change most of the fluid.



> Given the well-documented fragility of



ONLY SOME OF



> the V6
> auto trannies,



Honda has fixed this issue, which was due to a particular and very
specific design flaw. You need to see if your VIN is covered under the
extended transmisison warranty, or if the corrective repair has been
already carried out. Have your dealer check.



> and the comments I've read here in the past advising
> against flushes, I declined to have this done. Is there anyone who has
> anything positive to say about flushing, other than the shops for whom
> it appears to be a nice profit generator?



Drain and fill -- done the correct way -- is all you need. The factory
service manual gives the procedure.


>
> Power steering flush I'm not sure about - does the power steering
> system really require flushing, or is it like the trans where a
> drain-and-fill is just as effective, if not better?



Yep. Drain and fill is fine. Done correctly of course...



> This particular
> dealer wants $140 to do the power steering flush.



The price is fine. Just make sure they do the drain and fill properly,
and do not use any substances other than genuine Honda power steering
fluid,


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Dave Garrett wrote:
> Took my 99 Accord V6 to the dealer today for an "express" oil change
> that turned into a longer wait than expected. When the service advisor
> came out, he showed me samples from my power steering fluid and
> transmission fluid compared to samples from new fluids, and recommended
> that both systems be flushed.
>
> I just recently had a 90K mile service done on the car at the same
> dealer, and one of the services that was performed then was a drain-and-
> fill on the transmission. I told the advisor this, and he said they
> still recommended a flush. Given the well-documented fragility of the V6
> auto trannies, and the comments I've read here in the past advising
> against flushes, I declined to have this done. Is there anyone who has
> anything positive to say about flushing, other than the shops for whom
> it appears to be a nice profit generator?
>
> Power steering flush I'm not sure about - does the power steering system
> really require flushing, or is it like the trans where a drain-and-fill
> is just as effective, if not better? This particular dealer wants $140
> to do the power steering flush. I opted to do nothing for now except the
> oil change I'd come in for, pending further research. I also suspected
> that if the power steering fluid really needed to be changed, it would
> have been mentioned when the 90K service was done.
>
> Dave
>
STAY AWAY from this place. stay away from /any/ place that offers to
flush your honda.

1. power steering fluid is usually good for the life of the car. my
17-year old civic only had its fluid changed for the first time last
year. no problems whatsoever.
2. honda power steering systems will fail very expensively unless honda
fluid is used.
3. honda transmissions are drain & refill with honda fluid. google this
group for reasons and experience of others.

again, stay away from anywhere that offers to flush. very bad news.