Honda Car Forum

I had this problem with my 99 Accord 4 cyl at about 40k miles too. It was
definitely a safety hazard the way the pedal was sticking. I perform all
the maintenance myself and I do it within the recommend intervals listed in
the owners manual. I also had the extended warranty at that time.

Like your case, the dealer solved my problem by cleaning the throttle body.
Then he refused to cover the cost with the extended warranty because no
"parts" were replaced. To my way of thinking that was BS and I told them
so. If something goes wrong and it is not a regular maintenance action
listed in the manual, nor is it a consumable item like tires, wiper blades,
or light bulbs, then it is an engineering defect and should be covered by
the warranty. Anyway, I ended up paying the dealer for the cleaning and
then writing Honda headquarters and letting them know what I thought of
their scuzzy business practices. Honda Corp agreed to reimburse me for the
cost, but I still came away with a bad taste in my mouth because they still
got away with not covering it via the extended warranty. So guess who is
not buying anymore extended warranties.

By the way, the service rep at Honda Hdqrts recommended that I use Chevron
gas with Techroline and also periodically add a bottle of Techroline
additive to the gas tank in order to keep the problem from recurring. I
think he said I should add it at least every oil change. Well, Chevron is
the only gas I have ever bought since the car was new. I do add a bottle of
Techroline ever now and then and it hasn't recurred yet.

Sid


"NancyK" <none@000.com> wrote in message
news:948986_3dc7f1ef53e27f183ebff4ac5af1ddf1@autob oardz.com...
> Bought 2002 Accord coupe new. It has 40K miles.
> Just a few months after purchase the accelerator seemed to stick when
> starting up. Dealer "cleaned" something and the problem went away,
> only to return about 6 months later. I've had whatever it is in there
> "cleaned" a few more times since- the prob disappears- then returns.
> About a year ago the service manager told me if it happened again he'd
> replace the "throttle body" something for free.
>
> But now they say they won't do it- it will cost $150 to replace a
> "throttle body" thingie.
>
> I've read that this pedal stickiness is a fairly common problem. If I
> can clean this throttle body myself as opposed to spending $150 I'd
> rather do that. How do I know this throttle body thing even needs to
> be replaced? The gas pedal was fine for several months each time it
> was cleaned.
>
> Any thoughts? Thanks.
>
> --
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> author/report abuse
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>

Tegger wrote:
> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
> news:FMidnRcX4r4oWeHYnZ2dnUVZ_uuqnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>
>> Tegger wrote:
>
>> ~2k per change on m1? ordinary oil is good for way more than that.
>> provided there's no fuel mixture/ignition problems messing up
>> combustion, m1 should double conventional mileage, especially for a
>> freeway driver. last time i changed mine at 10k, it came out looking
>> much the same as it did at 2k - same consistency too. should have
>> left it in there for another 5k. especially as it had finished
>> getting burnt and the level was constant.
>
>
>
> I'm changing it every 3K now. It was 2.5K with Castrol GTX. I know I
> could leave it lots longer, but I'm paranoid here; I want to milk this
> motor for all it's worth. And when a rebuild is finally imperative, I
> want that crankshaft to be as perfect as possible.
>
> My oil gets jet-black after 3K, as does our Tercel's. And the Tercel has
> only 75K on it.

wow, that's not good. what plugs do you use? i know you live in colder
climes which can keep the motor running rich, but excessive soot in the
oil is a symptom of incomplete combustion. weak spark from the plugs
can cause that. that's not say the plugs don't fire, but if they're
weak, combustion is not complete - hence it's always recommended to have
new plugs when going for a smog test. cheapo gasoline can give poor
combustion too.

[i'm running ngk iridium plugs, ngk coiled core plug leads and have been
running chevron gas since about march. mine's still brown after 10k.]

>
>
>>> I tried 5W-30 first. Then I tried the ultra-fancy 0W-40. The last two
>>> were back to 5W-30. Mobil has a new 5W-50 mix, but I'm reluctant to
>>> try that one. I've heard bad things about oils with huge spreads
>>> between the numbers.
>>>
>>> I also tried the Castrol GTX 10W-30 regular and "High-Mileage"
>>> formulations at one point.
>>>
>>> The upshot of all this? NO change of any kind in oil consumption no
>>> mattter what oil I used.
>> i don't think you're giving it time to stabilize.
>
>
>
> There is no stabilization period. Either a car uses oil or it does not.

that's not true. if a base loses 15% of the lighter fractions, the
[heavier] remainder will not evaporate and losses will be stabilized.
then all you have to do is bring it back up to original level and it'll
remain pretty constant. and that theory is backed by my experience, as
reported above. mine's stable after about 2k, just when you're getting
ready to change yours!

> Mine does, and no brand or viscosity is having any effect.
>
>
>>> Two years ago, it was 2,200 in the dead of winter, and more like
>>> 1,600 in the summer. My rings are just plain worn out, and nothing
>>> will fix that except a rebuild.
>> did your head gasket dude use any abrasives when prepping for the new
>> one?
>
>
>
> Absolutely not. In fact, he was most emphatically against using any sort
> of abrasives when we discussed the job afterwards.

how did he clean the block mating surface? was there any difference
between consumption before and after the head gasket change?

>
> My oil consumption is due to high piston speeds

speed has nothing to do with it - it's temperature [pressure] and
distribution in the combustion chamber. high speed generally goes hand
in hand with temperature, but the speed alone is not the cause.

> and worn rings. Nothing
> else.

worn rings will do it for sure. what's compression like? have you done
a leakdown test?

>
> At 239K miles, consumption was an average of 2,000mi/qt.
> At 279K miles, it's an average of about 1,600mi/qt.
>
> It's declined 400mi/qt in 40,000 miles. If abrasives had been the
> culprit, It would have gone from 2,000 to 200 in a few thousand miles.

not so. it depends on the abrasive. something like scotchbrite is the
worst of the worst - it has needle shaped alumina spicules that embed in
surfaces causing abrasion for ever more. they will indeed cause ongoing
degradation. but something like silicon carbide, with a relatively even
grainy shape, will generally not embed and will sometimes, depending on
circumstances, work its way out and get carried away by the oil. excess
abrasion of any kind is a problem, but the /type/ of abrasion makes a
big difference.

Thanks very much Tegger for your reply.
I change the oil at the dealer every 3750 miles religiously even tho
the car is not driven under severe conditions.
I think I’m going to take it to the dealership I bought it from and
see if I can’t get a straight answer.
Elmo, the Honda service person said that the Odyssey and the Pilot
both DO have this problem but not the Accord. (I googled this and
found that indeed it exists for the Accord too) But I’ll be interested
in knowing what you’ve done to get yours corrected.

Tegger,
I am sorry to ask but what is a TSB?
Thanks....Nancy

"Tegger" wrote:
> "Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in
> news:elmop-B6E8EF.10491010122006@nntp4.usenetserver.com:
>
> > In article <Xns98955EB50A647tegger@207.14.116.130>,
> > Tegger <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote:
> >
> >> A sticky gas pedal is usually due to sludge and oil getting
> pumped
> >> into the throttle body from the crankcase breather tube.
> The usual
> >> reason for the oil is poor maintenance, specifically
> insufficient oil
> >> changes.
> >
> > There's plainly another reason, because it happens like this
> on my
> > father's 98 Odyssey (4 cylinder) and it happened like this
> on my 2000
> > Accord, both of which get very regular maintenance.
> >
> > There's something else going on with that particular engine.
> >
>
>
> Then there ought to be a TSB on the problem. The OP needs to
> ask his
> dealer.
>
> --
> Tegger
>
> The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
> www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

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Jim,

Interesting idea and plausible- I know nothing about cars as you might
gather but your explanation makes sense.

I’m the OP and wonder if you think that the lesser grade oil put in at
the dealer would still affect the throttle thing after about 5K miles.
Thats about the time it takes for me to notice it, even tho I always
change oil at 3750.

I’m going to call the original dealer and if I get the same run around
I am really going to be upset. Will report on what their verdict is.
Thanks

"jim beam" wrote
> Tegger wrote:
> > "Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in
> > news:elmop-B6E8EF.10491010122006@nntp4.usenetserver.com:
> >
> >> In article <Xns98955EB50A647tegger@207.14.116.130>,
> >> Tegger <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote:
> >>
> >>> A sticky gas pedal is usually due to sludge and oil
> getting pumped
> >>> into the throttle body from the crankcase breather tube.
> The usual
> >>> reason for the oil is poor maintenance, specifically
> insufficient oil
> >>> changes.
> >> There's plainly another reason, because it happens like
> this on my
> >> father's 98 Odyssey (4 cylinder) and it happened like this
> on my 2000
> >> Accord, both of which get very regular maintenance.
> >>
> >> There's something else going on with that particular
> engine.
> >>
> >
> >
> > Then there ought to be a TSB on the problem. The OP needs to
> ask his
> > dealer.
> >
> from what i can gather, the dealer solution is to spray
> throttle body
> cleaner in there and that's all. i agree with elmo that there
> is
> something going on. i agree that it's got to be something
> from the oil
> vapor like you say, but it shouldn't be happening nonetheless.
>
> this kinda-sorta brings me to something i've been meaning to
> post for a
> while. for the past year, i've been running mobil 1 as a
> science
> project. i've also done a lot of reading around the subject
> of motor
> oils [and believe me, oil companies are slipperier than their
> product
> when it comes to keeping consumers in the dark]. here's part
> of what i
> conclude, and it may be relevant in this case:
>
> m1 /definitely/ has a lower oil burn-off rate than castrol
> gtx. [this
> may be relevant for your integra tegger.] what i find is that
> within
> the first 1000-odd miles of high speed driving, my civic will
> burn about
> half a quart of m1, but after that, it'll burn maybe another
> quart over
> the whole next 9000 miles that i run it. including initial
> fill, that's
> a total of 5 quarts over 10k. not too shabby for a clunker.
> with gtx,
> a fine oil btw, it'll burn a quart in about 1500 miles, and
> keep on
> doing so, so it's a constant monitoring and refill process.
> over 6k, it
> uses nearly 7 quarts including initial fill.
>
> some of this burn-off is due to volatile fractions in the base
> oil
> simply evaporating at high temperatures of operation - no
> surprises
> there. the difference is that m1 is much more isomerised than
> gtx and
> therefore has a much narrower spectrum of molecular weights in
> the base
> oil. therefore, there are fewer over-light fractions that can
>
> evaporate. now, if evaporation means this oil vapor from the
> crank case
> being able to circulate to the throttle body via the breather
> and
> condense into goo when the motor is turned off, then it's
> worth
> experimenting with a different oil with a lower evaporation
> rate to see
> if it mitigates the problem. it'll cost an extra $20-odd
> bucks at oil
> change time, but how much does it cost to have the dealer take
> off the
> intake and squirt cleaner every 50k?
>
> just a thought.

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jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
news:u96dnZIwyfDIt-PYnZ2dnUVZ_vyunZ2d@speakeasy.net:

> Tegger wrote:
>> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
>> news:FMidnRcX4r4oWeHYnZ2dnUVZ_uuqnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>>
>>> Tegger wrote:
>>
>>> ~2k per change on m1? ordinary oil is good for way more than that.
>>> provided there's no fuel mixture/ignition problems messing up
>>> combustion, m1 should double conventional mileage, especially for a
>>> freeway driver. last time i changed mine at 10k, it came out
>>> looking much the same as it did at 2k - same consistency too.
>>> should have left it in there for another 5k. especially as it had
>>> finished getting burnt and the level was constant.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm changing it every 3K now. It was 2.5K with Castrol GTX. I know I
>> could leave it lots longer, but I'm paranoid here; I want to milk
>> this motor for all it's worth. And when a rebuild is finally
>> imperative, I want that crankshaft to be as perfect as possible.
>>
>> My oil gets jet-black after 3K, as does our Tercel's. And the Tercel
>> has only 75K on it.
>
> wow, that's not good. what plugs do you use? i know you live in
> colder climes which can keep the motor running rich, but excessive
> soot in the oil is a symptom of incomplete combustion. weak spark
> from the plugs can cause that. that's not say the plugs don't fire,
> but if they're weak, combustion is not complete - hence it's always
> recommended to have new plugs when going for a smog test. cheapo
> gasoline can give poor combustion too.



Plugs are OEM Denso, straight from the Toyota dealer. The gas is
whatever name-brand station is close by. The plugs are firing just fine,
as evidenced by very low HCs when the car is smogged, as well as the
obvious condition of the electrodes and insulators.



>>
>>
>> There is no stabilization period. Either a car uses oil or it does
>> not.
>
> that's not true. if a base loses 15% of the lighter fractions, the
> [heavier] remainder will not evaporate and losses will be stabilized.
> then all you have to do is bring it back up to original level and
> it'll remain pretty constant. and that theory is backed by my
> experience, as reported above. mine's stable after about 2k, just
> when you're getting ready to change yours!



So then I should notice a definite difference after 2K, and I do not.
Also, the car used to use no oil at all between changes, but that was
200,000 miles ago.

And the Tercel uses no oil either. If there were any evaporation going
on, I think we'd be seeing it in the Tercel.



>
>> Mine does, and no brand or viscosity is having any effect.
>>
>>
>>>> Two years ago, it was 2,200 in the dead of winter, and more like
>>>> 1,600 in the summer. My rings are just plain worn out, and nothing
>>>> will fix that except a rebuild.
>>> did your head gasket dude use any abrasives when prepping for the
>>> new one?
>>
>>
>>
>> Absolutely not. In fact, he was most emphatically against using any
>> sort of abrasives when we discussed the job afterwards.
>
> how did he clean the block mating surface? was there any difference
> between consumption before and after the head gasket change?
>
>>
>> My oil consumption is due to high piston speeds
>
> speed has nothing to do with it - it's temperature [pressure] and
> distribution in the combustion chamber. high speed generally goes
> hand in hand with temperature, but the speed alone is not the cause.




Piston speed has quite a lot to do with it. It's one reason the old-time
long-stroke engines would wear rings very quickly. This is a well-known
phenomenon.



>
>> and worn rings. Nothing
>> else.
>
> worn rings will do it for sure. what's compression like? have you
> done a leakdown test?
>
>>
>> At 239K miles, consumption was an average of 2,000mi/qt.
>> At 279K miles, it's an average of about 1,600mi/qt.
>>
>> It's declined 400mi/qt in 40,000 miles. If abrasives had been the
>> culprit, It would have gone from 2,000 to 200 in a few thousand
>> miles.
>
> not so. it depends on the abrasive. something like scotchbrite is
> the worst of the worst - it has needle shaped alumina spicules that
> embed in surfaces causing abrasion for ever more. they will indeed
> cause ongoing degradation. but something like silicon carbide, with a
> relatively even grainy shape, will generally not embed and will
> sometimes, depending on circumstances, work its way out and get
> carried away by the oil. excess abrasion of any kind is a problem,
> but the /type/ of abrasion makes a big difference.
>


Well he very explicitly and deliberately didn't use anything that might
drop into the bore, so that's a non-issue here. He reports that when he
did my head gasket, the bores were completely unscored, but were shiny
smooth all over. My heavy oil consumption predated the head gasket
change.

Also, my oil analysis showed very low silica in the oil, so that's not a
factor either. Use of a foam air filter, or an unfiltered leak into the
intake, will wear the rings/bores very quickly, but the evidence is high
silica in the oil.


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

NancyK <none@000.com> wrote in news:949210_6982fdd1bad4cf466dcd397fb82d12c7
@autoboardz.com:

> Tegger,
> I am sorry to ask but what is a TSB?



It's short for Technical Service Bulletin. It's a document Honda puts out
for its franchised dealers when a problem has arisen. TSBs list the
symptoms, causes, fixes, amd the VIN numbers of the cars that are suspected
of having the problem.

TSBs may be issued soon after the car is released, or up to years later,
depending on when a particular common problem surfaces.

Honda has to see a repeating pattern to the problems before they will issue
a TSB. They won't issue one if only a handful of cars come in with a
particular problem.


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

NancyK <none@000.com> wrote in news:949186
_d0f0c797e95fdfb2a89213dfb98484ed@0000.com:

> Thanks very much Tegger for your reply.
> I change the oil at the dealer every 3750 miles religiously even tho
> the car is not driven under severe conditions.
> I think I’m going to take it to the dealership I bought it from and
> see if I can’t get a straight answer.
> Elmo, the Honda service person said that the Odyssey and the Pilot
> both DO have this problem but not the Accord. (I googled this and
> found that indeed it exists for the Accord too) But I’ll be interested
> in knowing what you’ve done to get yours corrected.



As I say, there's only one source of oil in the intake. If you've changed
your oil as religiously as you say, then drainback should be unimpaired
from the valve cover baffles and there ought to be no oil in the intake.

DID the dealer do a VIN check for TSBs? Did they ever bother to remove the
valve cover and PCV valve to see if the baffles/valve were sludged up or
not? This is not rocket science.

By the way, the type of gasoline used, or the use or non-use of additives
like Techron, will have absolutely zero effect on oil in the intake. The
two things are totally unrelated.

--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Tegger wrote:
> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
> news:u96dnZIwyfDIt-PYnZ2dnUVZ_vyunZ2d@speakeasy.net:
>
>> Tegger wrote:
>>> jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
>>> news:FMidnRcX4r4oWeHYnZ2dnUVZ_uuqnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>>>
>>>> Tegger wrote:
>>>> ~2k per change on m1? ordinary oil is good for way more than that.
>>>> provided there's no fuel mixture/ignition problems messing up
>>>> combustion, m1 should double conventional mileage, especially for a
>>>> freeway driver. last time i changed mine at 10k, it came out
>>>> looking much the same as it did at 2k - same consistency too.
>>>> should have left it in there for another 5k. especially as it had
>>>> finished getting burnt and the level was constant.
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm changing it every 3K now. It was 2.5K with Castrol GTX. I know I
>>> could leave it lots longer, but I'm paranoid here; I want to milk
>>> this motor for all it's worth. And when a rebuild is finally
>>> imperative, I want that crankshaft to be as perfect as possible.
>>>
>>> My oil gets jet-black after 3K, as does our Tercel's. And the Tercel
>>> has only 75K on it.
>> wow, that's not good. what plugs do you use? i know you live in
>> colder climes which can keep the motor running rich, but excessive
>> soot in the oil is a symptom of incomplete combustion. weak spark
>> from the plugs can cause that. that's not say the plugs don't fire,
>> but if they're weak, combustion is not complete - hence it's always
>> recommended to have new plugs when going for a smog test. cheapo
>> gasoline can give poor combustion too.
>
>
>
> Plugs are OEM Denso, straight from the Toyota dealer. The gas is
> whatever name-brand station is close by. The plugs are firing just fine,
> as evidenced by very low HCs when the car is smogged,

yes but that could just be an efficient cat. oil burning cars don't
leave smoke trails like they used to - because of catalysts burning the
hydrocarbons.

> as well as the
> obvious condition of the electrodes and insulators.

that's encouraging.

>
>
>
>>>
>>> There is no stabilization period. Either a car uses oil or it does
>>> not.
>> that's not true. if a base loses 15% of the lighter fractions, the
>> [heavier] remainder will not evaporate and losses will be stabilized.
>> then all you have to do is bring it back up to original level and
>> it'll remain pretty constant. and that theory is backed by my
>> experience, as reported above. mine's stable after about 2k, just
>> when you're getting ready to change yours!
>
>
>
> So then I should notice a definite difference after 2K, and I do not.
> Also, the car used to use no oil at all between changes, but that was
> 200,000 miles ago.

oil consumption /can/ be worn rings - as discussed before, but my car
doesn't burn oil if i plod about town. it /does/ burn it if i gun it
though. that's high temperature.

>
> And the Tercel uses no oil either. If there were any evaporation going
> on, I think we'd be seeing it in the Tercel.

does the tercel get driven like the integra? valve timing on that thing
is real benign, so i doubt it could reach the same combustion temps,
even at full throttle.

>
>
>
>>> Mine does, and no brand or viscosity is having any effect.
>>>
>>>
>>>>> Two years ago, it was 2,200 in the dead of winter, and more like
>>>>> 1,600 in the summer. My rings are just plain worn out, and nothing
>>>>> will fix that except a rebuild.
>>>> did your head gasket dude use any abrasives when prepping for the
>>>> new one?
>>>
>>>
>>> Absolutely not. In fact, he was most emphatically against using any
>>> sort of abrasives when we discussed the job afterwards.
>> how did he clean the block mating surface? was there any difference
>> between consumption before and after the head gasket change?
>>
>>> My oil consumption is due to high piston speeds
>> speed has nothing to do with it - it's temperature [pressure] and
>> distribution in the combustion chamber. high speed generally goes
>> hand in hand with temperature, but the speed alone is not the cause.
>
>
>
>
> Piston speed has quite a lot to do with it. It's one reason the old-time
> long-stroke engines would wear rings very quickly. This is a well-known
> phenomenon.

speed => wear. wear => consumption. speed != consumption.

>
>
>
>>> and worn rings. Nothing
>>> else.
>> worn rings will do it for sure. what's compression like? have you
>> done a leakdown test?
>>
>>> At 239K miles, consumption was an average of 2,000mi/qt.
>>> At 279K miles, it's an average of about 1,600mi/qt.
>>>
>>> It's declined 400mi/qt in 40,000 miles. If abrasives had been the
>>> culprit, It would have gone from 2,000 to 200 in a few thousand
>>> miles.
>> not so. it depends on the abrasive. something like scotchbrite is
>> the worst of the worst - it has needle shaped alumina spicules that
>> embed in surfaces causing abrasion for ever more. they will indeed
>> cause ongoing degradation. but something like silicon carbide, with a
>> relatively even grainy shape, will generally not embed and will
>> sometimes, depending on circumstances, work its way out and get
>> carried away by the oil. excess abrasion of any kind is a problem,
>> but the /type/ of abrasion makes a big difference.
>>
>
>
> Well he very explicitly and deliberately didn't use anything that might
> drop into the bore, so that's a non-issue here.

what /did/ he use? i spent hours and hours shaving crud off mine with a
fine blade. no abrasives. i seriously doubt he had the time to do what
i did.

> He reports that when he
> did my head gasket, the bores were completely unscored, but were shiny
> smooth all over.

ideally, they should still have shown the original cross-hatching.

> My heavy oil consumption predated the head gasket
> change.

ok, that was what i was driving at - that's definitely wear.

>
> Also, my oil analysis showed very low silica in the oil, so that's not a
> factor either.

good.

> Use of a foam air filter, or an unfiltered leak into the
> intake, will wear the rings/bores very quickly, but the evidence is high
> silica in the oil.

indeed.

regarding evaporation though, consider one last thing. just like
"synthetic" oil being a different formulation today than how it was
originally, there's no reason a producer can't "weight" the base oil for
higher consumption today compared to before. there's ZERO content
information on the bottle, so unless you have a lab, you'd never be able
to tell.

jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
news:maydnb6nI8hnGeLYnZ2dnUVZ_hm3nZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:

> Tegger wrote:

>>
>>
>> So then I should notice a definite difference after 2K, and I do not.
>> Also, the car used to use no oil at all between changes, but that was
>> 200,000 miles ago.
>
> oil consumption /can/ be worn rings - as discussed before, but my car
> doesn't burn oil if i plod about town. it /does/ burn it if i gun it
> though. that's high temperature.



Definitely. And I did say that. My oil consumption goes down
significantly in the winter, which is definitely due to lower oil
temperatures. At zero F, it's difficult for the oil in the pan to reach
210F even with highway driving.

However, my consumption is still high across the board. And since I'm on
the highway about 80-90% of the time (during off-peak hours), I can't
spend enough time at city speed to be able to see if there's a
difference.

If I ever end up rebuilding my gearbox, I'm contemplating changing the
5th gear set for something higher, to reduce revs at highways speeds.



>
>>
>> And the Tercel uses no oil either. If there were any evaporation
>> going on, I think we'd be seeing it in the Tercel.
>
> does the tercel get driven like the integra? valve timing on that
> thing is real benign, so i doubt it could reach the same combustion
> temps, even at full throttle.



Yes, but as I said earlier, when my car had 75K on it, it used no oil
between changes regardless of how hard the engine was driven. My driving
then was much like it is now.



>>
>> Well he very explicitly and deliberately didn't use anything that
>> might drop into the bore, so that's a non-issue here.
>
> what /did/ he use? i spent hours and hours shaving crud off mine with
> a fine blade. no abrasives. i seriously doubt he had the time to do
> what i did.



He used a blade and time. He tells me there are no shortcuts when
removing the head gasket remnants.

He also says he's seen plenty of engines where someone has used
ScotchBrite or sandpaper to clean the block face, and these invariably
develop oil consumption problems very quickly, much faster than in 40K
miles.



>
>> He reports that when he
>> did my head gasket, the bores were completely unscored, but were
>> shiny smooth all over.
>
> ideally, they should still have shown the original cross-hatching.



Sorry, that's what I meant. The crosshatching wears enough to make the
surface a bit shiny compared to brand new, is what I was getting at.


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/