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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 22 Apr 2006, 03:46 am
Charles Lasitter
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Default Six-Speed + i4: Why not?

I really love this engine, and think that an LX or EX in this
configuration would be a welcome addition for Honda. With the bump
in horsepower for the i4 in 2006, I'm not sure I know what I'd do
with the horsepower in the v6.

Can anyone here peer into their crystal ball and see this combination in
Honda's future?
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| 401/728-1987 | 14 Cooke St |
| cl+at+ncdm+dot+com | Pawtucket RI 02860 |
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 22 Apr 2006, 02:52 pm
Bob Jones
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Default Re: Six-Speed + i4: Why not?


"Charles Lasitter" <spoof@address.com> wrote in message
news:fvqj42hd5uh35dqoral90r2vpr39qfinb7@4ax.com...
>I really love this engine, and think that an LX or EX in this
> configuration would be a welcome addition for Honda. With the bump
> in horsepower for the i4 in 2006, I'm not sure I know what I'd do
> with the horsepower in the v6.
>
> Can anyone here peer into their crystal ball and see this combination in
> Honda's future?


I test drove a 5-speed manual Accord a couple of years ago. The shifter was
not sporty, so I bought an Acura RSX with a shorter stick.

4-cyl Accords are not sporty, so I don't think they will be made with
6-speed manual.


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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 23 Apr 2006, 02:10 am
Charles Lasitter
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Default Re: Six-Speed + i4: Why not?

On Sat, 22 Apr 2006 19:52:31 GMT, "Bob Jones" <email@me.not> wrote:

> 4-cyl Accords are not sporty, so I don't think they will be made
> with 6-speed manual.


I guess it depends on what you're comparing the engine against.

I test drove a '07 Toyota SE today, and while I love the comparative
boatload of features you get for the money with the Toyota SE, the
Honda K24A4 has the persona of a caged beast compared to the 4-cyl
Toyota 2AZFE.

I know there's only eight horsepower difference between the two, but for
some reason I kept thinking "putter-putter-putter" while I was driving
the Toyota.
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| Charles Lasitter | Mailing/Shipping |
| 401/728-1987 | 14 Cooke St |
| cl+at+ncdm+dot+com | Pawtucket RI 02860 |
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 23 Apr 2006, 04:11 am
DervMan
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Default Re: Six-Speed + i4: Why not?

"Bob Jones" <email@me.not> wrote in message
news:3Qv2g.62910$F_3.3147@newssvr29.news.prodigy.n et...
>
> "Charles Lasitter" <spoof@address.com> wrote in message
> news:fvqj42hd5uh35dqoral90r2vpr39qfinb7@4ax.com...
>>I really love this engine, and think that an LX or EX in this
>> configuration would be a welcome addition for Honda. With the bump
>> in horsepower for the i4 in 2006, I'm not sure I know what I'd do
>> with the horsepower in the v6.
>>
>> Can anyone here peer into their crystal ball and see this combination in
>> Honda's future?

>
> I test drove a 5-speed manual Accord a couple of years ago. The shifter
> was not sporty, so I bought an Acura RSX with a shorter stick.
>
> 4-cyl Accords are not sporty,


You forgot "US specification" there.

The previous generation Accord has 105 bhp (2.0td), 108 bhp (106), 134 bhp
(1.8), 145 (2.0) and 210 (2.2) four cylinder options.

The current one has 150 bhp (2.0) and 190 bhp (2.4) options. Oh and a 135
bhp 2.2 diesel too.

> so I don't think they will be made with 6-speed manual.


See above comment about "US specification" heh.

--
The DervMan
www.dervman.com


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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 23 Apr 2006, 09:54 am
Bob Jones
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Default Re: Six-Speed + i4: Why not?


"Charles Lasitter" <spoof@address.com> wrote in message
news:dc9m42d3gknvpojbjga9svjrtl23bvkbqb@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 22 Apr 2006 19:52:31 GMT, "Bob Jones" <email@me.not> wrote:
>
>> 4-cyl Accords are not sporty, so I don't think they will be made
>> with 6-speed manual.

>
> I guess it depends on what you're comparing the engine against.
>
> I test drove a '07 Toyota SE today, and while I love the comparative
> boatload of features you get for the money with the Toyota SE, the
> Honda K24A4 has the persona of a caged beast compared to the 4-cyl
> Toyota 2AZFE.
>
> I know there's only eight horsepower difference between the two, but for
> some reason I kept thinking "putter-putter-putter" while I was driving
> the Toyota.


Yuh, Toyota Camry is more of an all-around family cruiser. It is by no mean
sporty, but it does have a good quality ride and interior.

Horsepower can be deceiving. BMW feels more powerful with slightly less
horsepower than many V6s out there. With Accord, you really have to kick it
up to high RPMs.


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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 23 Apr 2006, 03:47 pm
ACAR
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Default Re: Six-Speed + i4: Why not?


Charles Lasitter wrote:
>
> I know there's only eight horsepower difference between the two, but for
> some reason I kept thinking "putter-putter-putter" while I was driving
> the Toyota.
>


But were you going slower?
Did you actually look at the speedo to compare speed at various places
along the same test drive route? (Then you get to figure out how much
of any speed difference may be due to those high performance tires you
put onto your Accord vs. the lousy tires on the Camry.)

Neither the Accord or Camry is especially sporty but you might see a
6-speed in the Accord I4 if Honda decides to standardize 6-speed
manuals.

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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 23 Apr 2006, 06:09 pm
Charles Lasitter
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Default Re: Six-Speed + i4: Why not?

On 23 Apr 2006 13:47:45 -0700, "ACAR" <getoutanpush@yahoo.com> wrote:

> But were you going slower?


Nope. Pretty much same speeds.

> (Then you get to figure out how much of any speed difference may be due to
> those high performance tires you put onto your Accord vs. the lousy tires
> on the Camry.)


Uh-Oh! Been keeping track of my mods to the Honda ....

It has the same Michelin Energy MXV4 S8s that I had stock in the Honda,
except they were 15" in the Honda vs 16" in the Toyota LE. I really
hated those tires, so I replaced them with the 215-55/16 P Zero Nero
M&S.

Still, the Honda i4 will bust those tires loose effortlessly..

I just think it's obvious that the Camry designers are gearing their
efforts towards a nice, safe, tame, family market.

> Neither the Accord or Camry is especially sporty but you might see a
> 6-speed in the Accord I4 if Honda decides to standardize 6-speed
> manuals.


That'd be a dream come true for me. But unfortunately Honda and Toyota
seem to approach options completely differently.

I guess, more than anything else, I'm really keen on finding out what
kind of new standard features the '07 Accords will have in response to
the incredible list of standard features that are available on the
Camry.
+-----------------------------------------+
| Charles Lasitter | Mailing/Shipping |
| 401/728-1987 | 14 Cooke St |
| cl+at+ncdm+dot+com | Pawtucket RI 02860 |
+-----------------------------------------+
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 24 Apr 2006, 04:11 pm
Kaz Kylheku
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Default Re: Six-Speed + i4: Why not?

Bob Jones wrote:
> 4-cyl Accords are not sporty, so I don't think they will be made with
> 6-speed manual.


There are good non-sporty applications for a 6 speed gearbox. Even in
ordinary use, five speeds can sometimes feel a little bit too wide
apart over a weak inline 4, particularly one with poor low-end torque.

In day to day city driving, I keep the RPM in the 1800 to 2200 range
most of the time, sometimes venturing into the 2500-3000 zone (often
because there isn't a good gear available to avoid it!) In this narrow
"conservative band", it is just as useful to have more gears as it is
to have them in the power band.

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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 24 Apr 2006, 05:16 pm
Dr Nick
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Default Re: Six-Speed + i4: Why not?


"Kaz Kylheku" <kkylheku@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1145913104.853560.73380@g10g2000cwb.googlegro ups.com...
> Bob Jones wrote:
>> 4-cyl Accords are not sporty, so I don't think they will be made with
>> 6-speed manual.

>
> There are good non-sporty applications for a 6 speed gearbox. Even in
> ordinary use, five speeds can sometimes feel a little bit too wide
> apart over a weak inline 4, particularly one with poor low-end torque.
>
> In day to day city driving, I keep the RPM in the 1800 to 2200 range
> most of the time, sometimes venturing into the 2500-3000 zone (often
> because there isn't a good gear available to avoid it!) In this narrow
> "conservative band", it is just as useful to have more gears as it is
> to have them in the power band.
>


I agree, don't they use a 6 speed in the TSX that uses the same engine
(although with a higher compression ratio)? seems like they coudl just
standardize the manual to be a 6 speed with minor gearing tweeks for the 2
different engines. Hell, if they want to boost highway efficency, they could
put 5th and 6th as overdrives, and just make 6th a super tall gear. 40 MPG
highway?? ;-)

-Nick


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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 25 Apr 2006, 02:32 am
DervMan
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Six-Speed + i4: Why not?

"Dr Nick" <Drnick5@cox.net> wrote in message
news:H6c3g.15387$NG.9056@dukeread10...
>
> "Kaz Kylheku" <kkylheku@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1145913104.853560.73380@g10g2000cwb.googlegro ups.com...
>> Bob Jones wrote:
>>> 4-cyl Accords are not sporty, so I don't think they will be made with
>>> 6-speed manual.

>>
>> There are good non-sporty applications for a 6 speed gearbox. Even in
>> ordinary use, five speeds can sometimes feel a little bit too wide
>> apart over a weak inline 4, particularly one with poor low-end torque.
>>
>> In day to day city driving, I keep the RPM in the 1800 to 2200 range
>> most of the time, sometimes venturing into the 2500-3000 zone (often
>> because there isn't a good gear available to avoid it!) In this narrow
>> "conservative band", it is just as useful to have more gears as it is
>> to have them in the power band.
>>

>
> I agree, don't they use a 6 speed in the TSX that uses the same engine
> (although with a higher compression ratio)? seems like they coudl just
> standardize the manual to be a 6 speed with minor gearing tweeks for the 2
> different engines. Hell, if they want to boost highway efficency, they
> could put 5th and 6th as overdrives, and just make 6th a super tall gear.
> 40 MPG highway?? ;-)



Hmmmmm... I still reckon having more than one overdriven gear is a waste of
flexibility lower down. Perhaps raising the final drive and putting fifth
as the direct drive...?

--
The DervMan
www.dervman.com


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