Honda Car Forum

"Adrian" <toomany2cvs@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:76sk35F1ed7kpU1@mid.individual.net...
<shrug> Your lack of imagination is not my problem.
>
> Here in the UQ, 18k miles/two years is not unusual as a service interval
> for recent cars, including for both current Saabs. Very few cars here
> "die" because of worn out engines.

Surely these long intervals are due to the numberof companies buying FLEETS
of cars and they only look at the pence (or whatever) per mile and are not
too worried about a long life.

Vauxhall/Opels have 2 yr service/oil change as you say but loads die around
60k/3 years due to thye oil issue - sometimes ts the turbo

Another example - audi - computer can be set to 10K services or "long life"
services - any mechanic worth his aslt would tell you don't touch the long
life serviced cars IF you are the sort that "owns" their car or keeps them
for years

Adrian <toomany2cvs@gmail.com> writes:

> yoda <yoda@Dagobah.net> gurgled happily, sounding much like they were
> saying:
>
>> On 2009-05-11 01:22:16 -0500, Adrian <toomany2cvs@gmail.com> said:
>>
>>> Hachiroku ãƒ�ãƒ�ãƒ*ク <Trueno@e86.GTS> gurgled happily, sounding much like
>>> they were saying:
>>>
>>>> You have to do SOME maintenance! Were these the people like the ones
>>>> that came into the service department when I was there, NEVER changed
>>>> their oil (one documented case of 15,000 miles without an oil change!)
>>>> and then wonder why the car blew up?
>>>
>>> Gosh! FIFTEEN THOUSAND miles?
>>>
>>> FFS, that's less than the recommended service interval on most new cars
>>> over here... You 'merkins and your outdated obsession with changing the
>>> oil every ten minutes.
>
>> Where's "over here"? US miles are different than kilometers, ya know...
>
> Just as well I'm not in a KM country, then. I wonder... If I was, d'you
> think I'd have mentioned that? Yes, I think I might have...
>
>> I can't think of anyplace that lets cars go 15K miles between oil
>> changes, unless it's one of those arab countries where cars are much
>> more expendable than they are here.
>
> <shrug> Your lack of imagination is not my problem.
>
> Here in the UQ, 18k miles/two years is not unusual as a service interval
> for recent cars, including for both current Saabs. Very few cars here
> "die" because of worn out engines.

Recent Audi/VW diesels have up to 50kkm (~30kmi) intervals.

On 12 May 2009 06:42:45 GMT, Adrian <toomany2cvs@gmail.com> wrote:

>> I can't think of anyplace that lets cars go 15K miles between oil
>> changes, unless it's one of those arab countries where cars are much
>> more expendable than they are here.
>
><shrug> Your lack of imagination is not my problem.
>
>Here in the UQ, 18k miles/two years is not unusual as a service interval
>for recent cars, including for both current Saabs. Very few cars here
>"die" because of worn out engines.

Actually, if you could measure the pressure across
the oil filter & go by that ....
--
Cliff

On Tue, 12 May 2009 09:24:04 GMT, Thomas Tornblom <thomas@Hax.SE> wrote:

>> Here in the UQ, 18k miles/two years is not unusual as a service interval
>> for recent cars, including for both current Saabs. Very few cars here
>> "die" because of worn out engines.
>
>Recent Audi/VW diesels have up to 50kkm (~30kmi) intervals.

They burn some oil for you to replace every few miles, right?
What of filter changes?
--
Cliff

Cliff <Clhuprich@aol.com> writes:

> On Tue, 12 May 2009 09:24:04 GMT, Thomas Tornblom <thomas@Hax.SE> wrote:
>
>>> Here in the UQ, 18k miles/two years is not unusual as a service interval
>>> for recent cars, including for both current Saabs. Very few cars here
>>> "die" because of worn out engines.
>>
>>Recent Audi/VW diesels have up to 50kkm (~30kmi) intervals.
>
> They burn some oil for you to replace every few miles, right?
> What of filter changes?
> --
> Cliff

The 180hp 2001 audi 2.5 tdi I had normally said it wanted service
about every 20kkm. That is with the VAG approved Long Life oil,
otherwise it is a fixed interval, about 15kkm. I usually needed to top
up with about a liter (quart for you :-) between the oil changes.

Nicest daily driver I've had. Too bad my son got T-bone:d in it in an
intersection. Luckily he was driving that car at the time. Both cars
were junk, but no injuries.

On Mon, 11 May 2009 14:40:25 -0400, Hachiroku ???? <Trueno@e86.GTS>
wrote:

>On Mon, 11 May 2009 06:22:16 +0000, Adrian wrote:
>
>> Hachiroku ???? <Trueno@e86.GTS> gurgled happily, sounding much like they
>> were saying:
>>
>>> You have to do SOME maintenance! Were these the people like the ones
>>> that came into the service department when I was there, NEVER changed
>>> their oil (one documented case of 15,000 miles without an oil change!)
>>> and then wonder why the car blew up?
>>
>> Gosh! FIFTEEN THOUSAND miles?
>>
>> FFS, that's less than the recommended service interval on most new cars
>> over here... You 'merkins and your outdated obsession with changing the
>> oil every ten minutes.
>
>
>WHAT?!?!?!
>
>I don't let Dino oil go more than 5K! I change my synthetic at 4.5K.
>
>Works for me. Last three cars all had well over 250,000 on them.
>
Saabs in the UK are supposed to use fully synthetic oil - much more
expensive, but longer between services (and few sludge problems).

my 03 V6 TiD Saab is one of the few that has recommended changes of
only 12,000 miles (the more recent 1.9 diesels are 18000 miles, and i
think the petrols even more).

>The problems with the Toyotas was someone designed the oil passages too
>narrow, and sludging occurred. The MFG's recommendation was 7,500 miles.
>Most of the sludging occurred beyond that point. There were a few cases of
>sludging at or below the recommendation of 7,500, and anyone that says
>they experienced sludging <5,000 between changes was either doing
>something horribly wrong, went to Jiffy-Lube, or is blowing smoke rings up
>your nether regions...
>
>BTW, Toyota's recommendation was lowered to 5K after that.
>
>I guess they hope those few people would change their oil <12,000...
>
--
Regards

stephen_hope@xyzworld.com - replace xyz with ntl

Stephen <stephen_hope@xyzworld.com> gurgled happily, sounding much like
they were saying:

>>WHAT?!?!?!
>>
>>I don't let Dino oil go more than 5K! I change my synthetic at 4.5K.
>>
>>Works for me. Last three cars all had well over 250,000 on them.

God alone knows what change regime my c900 T16's had in it's 19yrs, but
it's rapidly approaching 200k with no lubrication-related problems
whatsoever.

> Saabs in the UK are supposed to use fully synthetic oil - much more
> expensive, but longer between services (and few sludge problems).

Does _anybody_ but the pikiest cheapskates use anything less than semi-
synth these days? Especially in a turbo, why on earth would you use dino?

> my 03 V6 TiD Saab is one of the few that has recommended changes of only
> 12,000 miles (the more recent 1.9 diesels are 18000 miles, and i think
> the petrols even more).

No, they're all 18k.

Saab have had problems with sludge, too - but that's down to a cockup on
some breather designs - rectified by redesigning the breathers.

On 12 May 2009 19:44:46 GMT, Adrian <toomany2cvs@gmail.com> wrote:

>> Saabs in the UK are supposed to use fully synthetic oil - much more
>> expensive, but longer between services (and few sludge problems).
>
>Does _anybody_ but the pikiest cheapskates use anything less than semi-
>synth these days? Especially in a turbo, why on earth would you use dino?

The synthetic vs. non difference needs to be accounted for in these
discussions of change intervals, especially when manufacturer
recommended. That said, using non-synthetic with a turbo car is a
really bad idea.

>> my 03 V6 TiD Saab is one of the few that has recommended changes of only
>> 12,000 miles (the more recent 1.9 diesels are 18000 miles, and i think
>> the petrols even more).
>
>No, they're all 18k.

As someone noted earlier, most Americans are obsessed with 3k change
intervals from the dino days. Even with synthetic, they only go 5K.
There are some quality differences in oils from the USA to Europe, but
they don't account for the change interval differences except through
tradition.

Keep in mind that in the USA these intervals came up when oil was dirt
cheap and it was inexpensive for the owner and cheap insurance for the
manufacturer to change the oil frequently. It was only when some Euro
cars started pushing the change interval that American manufacturers
sat up and took notice that this was actually a marketing feature.


>Saab have had problems with sludge, too - but that's down to a cockup on
>some breather designs - rectified by redesigning the breathers.

Yes, I believe the 9~5 is on revision #5 or 6 at last count. We never
saw these problems before 2002 or so. Toyota likewise never had any
problems until some changes a few years ago.

One difference was that Toyota vehemently denied any responsibility
and blamed it all on owners failing to change oil for years, fighting
it until the wave of complaints on the Internet overwhelmed them and
the grudgingly gave in. Saab, OTOH, acknowledged the problem and has
paid for many,many repairs without complaint. It remains to be seen if
the new Saab will have the same level of service.

On Tue, 12 May 2009 17:27:41 -0400, me <noemail@nothere.com> wrote:

>Keep in mind that in the USA these intervals came up when oil was dirt
>cheap and it was inexpensive for the owner and cheap insurance for the
>manufacturer to change the oil frequently. It was only when some Euro
>cars started pushing the change interval that American manufacturers
>sat up and took notice that this was actually a marketing feature.

They took the Lead out of gasoline. It was never in diesel IIRC.
The Lead deposits were a problem that caused a need for
oil changes.

Any thoughts on the original claims about various makes &
bad heads?
--
Cliff

On 2009-05-12 01:42:45 -0500, Adrian <toomany2cvs@gmail.com> said:

> yoda <yoda@Dagobah.net> gurgled happily, sounding much like they were
> saying:
>
>> On 2009-05-11 01:22:16 -0500, Adrian <toomany2cvs@gmail.com> said:
>>
>>> Hachiroku ãƒ�ãƒ�ãƒ*ク <Trueno@e86.GTS> gurgled happily, sounding much like
>>> they were saying:
>>>
>>>> You have to do SOME maintenance! Were these the people like the ones
>>>> that came into the service department when I was there, NEVER changed
>>>> their oil (one documented case of 15,000 miles without an oil change!)
>>>> and then wonder why the car blew up?
>>>
>>> Gosh! FIFTEEN THOUSAND miles?
>>>
>>> FFS, that's less than the recommended service interval on most new cars
>>> over here... You 'merkins and your outdated obsession with changing the
>>> oil every ten minutes.
>
>> Where's "over here"? US miles are different than kilometers, ya know...
>
> Just as well I'm not in a KM country, then. I wonder... If I was, d'you
> think I'd have mentioned that? Yes, I think I might have...

Yes, sorry about that. Just making sure. Didn't mean what it sounded like.

>
>> I can't think of anyplace that lets cars go 15K miles between oil
>> changes, unless it's one of those arab countries where cars are much
>> more expendable than they are here.
>
> <shrug> Your lack of imagination is not my problem.
>
> Here in the UQ, 18k miles/two years is not unusual as a service interval
> for recent cars, including for both current Saabs. Very few cars here
> "die" because of worn out engines.

Oh no - no lack of imagination here - I can apparently imagine all
kinds of things. What I DO lack is specific knowledge, but I'm starting
to piece some of it together. I still don't know what the UQ is? Sorry,
dumbass american here.

So, is this 18K/2 years thing really working out as well as a more
frequent service interval, statistically speaking? I see that this
thread is crossposted all over the place - lets say if we took
otherwise identical cars, and used the euro 18k/2 year thing on one,
and did the murican 5k thing on the other, would both cars drive as
well after 250K miles? I'm posting this from the acura group, and
getting hondas and acuras to go 250k is not unusual here in the
southern usa, where instant oil change places are everywhere, and it's
not considered a big deal to change the oil regularly (I.E. 5k or so).
And I know from my own experience of changing my own oil that there's
some pretty significant degradation in what comes out of the engine
after about 5K - I'd hate to have that stuff keeping my car ticking for
another 13K.

Just curious really - no offenses meant! Thanks for everyone's input in this.


--
-----------------------------
I only talk like that in the movies