By way of introduction: I don't drive very much, and dislike driving. My '85
Camry has 91K on it - it's main use is to transport my bicycle to the start of
club rides, and to do shopping and the like. Unfortunately for me, the Camry
is falling apart from age - starting to burn oil, barely passed the California
smog check (hit the absolute limit on low-speed hydrocarbons), and everything
is starting to crumble. Even the electric window rollers inside the door are
disintegrating! It is not long for this world.

A couple folks in my bicycle club have purchased Elements in the last month.
I never heard of it before seeing these vehicles. It is the most god-awful
ugly thing I've ever seen. That and the utter practicality for carrying a
bike have whetted my interest. The poor fuel mileage and the rather
over-the-top stereo system are turnoffs, but everything else about the vehicle
is really appealing. I can picture an orange Element in my life.

These folks told me that the local dealers (Orange County, CA) add on a
surcharge and negotiate downward from there. Yeah, right.

There's a dealer in the Los Angeles area with an interesting web site. For
any vehicle, the computer user configures the vehicle and options
appropriately - pretty easy on an Element given no options - and then is
presented with what's alleged to be a wholesale and retail price. One then
submits an offer and allegedly has it rejected or accepted.

Does this seem like an intelligent way to purchase a car, as opposed to buying
services, auto brokers, and the like? Would the fact that I'm paying cash,
not financing, be a plus or a minus or neither? What would You offer, given
wholesale price $X and retail price $Y.

Last question: anyone know about the 2004 Element, and whether it would be
more desireable than the 2003? I have the luxury of time for this potential
purchase.

Art